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[paul_tyler]: this is paul tyler and welcome to
another episode of the imagined podcast laura how
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[paul_tyler]: are you
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[laura_dinan_haber]: i’m doing well today paul it’s it’s
great to be here
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[paul_tyler]: it is and i think
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: ye
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[paul_tyler]: we’re all getting probably assuming a lot
of the listeners
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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[paul_tyler]: are playing to go to insure tech
connect which is a community that’s done a
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[paul_tyler]: lot to advance innovation so the our
insurance
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[paul_tyler]: eco system and that actually is going
to be a
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: subset of our discussion today i’m really
excited about the conversation so today we’re really
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[paul_tyler]: going to talk about how cities
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: oh
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[paul_tyler]: foster innovation and what that means for
our insurance community could mean for our insurance
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[paul_tyler]: company here in hartford and so we
want to try to connect
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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[paul_tyler]: some ideas they’ve taken place in canada
and beyond we have great guests and also
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[paul_tyler]: talk about how that how that connects
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yes
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[paul_tyler]: are or may change how we think
about heart so lord do you want to
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[paul_tyler]: do the actual intros
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
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[laura_dinan_haber]: absolutely
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[jackie_mandyck]: oh
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[laura_dinan_haber]: so with
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
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[laura_dinan_haber]: us today we have paul cupflesh
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[jackie_mandyck]: oh
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[laura_dinan_haber]: principal consultant of paul
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[paul_tyler]: yeah
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[laura_dinan_haber]: consulting ink he’s co author of the
book the joint experiment
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[jackie_mandyck]: ah
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[laura_dinan_haber]: starting a new conversation on city building
and our local hartford home town hero jackie
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[laura_dinan_haber]: vandyke who is the executive director of
the i quit partnership and she worked
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[laura_dinan_haber]: to provide leadership for the initiatives and
the objectives leading i quit hartford four hundred
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[laura_dinan_haber]: and so many more things so paul
and jackie thank you so much for being
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[laura_dinan_haber]: here with us today
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[paul_tyler]: yes
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[laura_dinan_haber]: for the sake of our listeners
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[laura_dinan_haber]: paul please you know introduce yourself and
tell us a little bit about the work
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[laura_dinan_haber]: that you’re doing currently and what brought
you here today
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[paul_tyler]: m
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: sure so
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[paul_tyler]: m
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: my name is paul call flesh and
has mentioned i’m principle of my my own
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: consulting form paul consulting which i spend
most of my time working in the southern
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: ontario area of canada and primarily in
the waterloo region helping developers real state developers
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: and levels of city try to create
what i call good density good density being
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: vibrant communities and especially in the waterloo
region vibrant types of communities and structure really
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: fosters
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[jackie_mandyck]: ye
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: growth in the innovation economy which is
very important to that region
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[paul_tyler]: and and paul you actually have ties
into the insurance community as well correct
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yes that
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: is true i have sort of a
zigzag career i started my career off in
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: the world of advertising and then spent
eight years in the insurance industry at a
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: company called the mutual life of canada
which was i think at that time about
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: the second or third largest insurance company
in canada but it was during the dmutualization
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: process so i spent eight years in
the insurance industry and and was involved in
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: the helping that company go through the
mutualization process now it’s part of sun life
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: which is a a company that many
people sort of know about so while i’m
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: now in sort of more of a
very maybe cutting edge or
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: area where a lot of ideas are
floating around and having to land them i’ve
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: also spent time my time in the
insurance industry so i have a good sort
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: of understanding of that person spective today’s
topic
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[paul_tyler]: jackie tell us but who who are
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: you and what do you do
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[jackie_mandyck]: oh
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[paul_tyler]: in our community
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[jackie_mandyck]: thanks paul and thanks for having me
here today so my name is jackie
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[paul_tyler]: m
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[jackie_mandyck]: manike and i’m the executive director of
the i quit partnership and the partnership started
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[jackie_mandyck]: about fourteen years ago over the bushnell
center for the performing arts we looked at
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[jackie_mandyck]: a lot of ways that you can
connect our down town hartford our capital city
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[jackie_mandyck]: here in the state of connecticut and
how we were going to grow with trying
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[jackie_mandyck]: to create a more walkable
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: more connected downtown and city through creative
place
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: making and some very innovative designs so
we started out that way and we’ve evolved
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[jackie_mandyck]: over the past decade plus working on
a lot of small and major projects one
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[jackie_mandyck]: of the major projects we’re working on
right now is called hartford four hundred that
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[jackie_mandyck]: we’ve been working with congress man larson
and other local officials
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: it
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[jackie_mandyck]: to really
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: look at what do we want the
capital region to be like in the year
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[jackie_mandyck]: twenty thirty five when we turn four
hundred years old so how can we get
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[jackie_mandyck]: there what can we do what kind
of strategies can we implement to really make
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[jackie_mandyck]: this region what we all want
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: to live work and play it
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[paul_tyler]: yea and we we’ve laura and i’ve
spent a lot of time working with a
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[paul_tyler]: subset of that group to say how
do we bring innovation insurance to hartford and
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[paul_tyler]: inside
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
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[paul_tyler]: you know
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[paul_tyler]: the companies
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: this weekend i was reading the new
york times
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: okay
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[paul_tyler]: and i thought you know picked up
a section and had a whole section on
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[paul_tyler]: how covid re defined education and that
a
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: hm
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[paul_tyler]: great piece it’s you know hey had
people taking different positions it’s about social mobility
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[paul_tyler]: it’s about learning it’s about you know
taking care of kids you know it’s take
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[paul_tyler]: care
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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[paul_tyler]: is probably a pajorityf term but it
was important important
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: for a lot of families to
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: to work but you know you know
paul i pulled out your book and kind
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[paul_tyler]: of went back threw it in an
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: ye
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[paul_tyler]: i’ll throw quite first question
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: out to both of you is coming
out of covid how has the definition of
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[paul_tyler]: a purpose of a city changed hasn’t
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[jackie_mandyck]: we
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh oh um that’s a very big
question so there’s probably several layers to that
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: answer i think um one
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[jackie_mandyck]: ye
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: aspect of cities is that we’ve all
spent a lot of time being isolated and
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: i think as we come out of
that we now have a greater sense for
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: need to be together and all of
a sudden the idea of public space the
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: space between buildings is becoming not just
a place to go and sit on a
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: park bench but a place to congregate
and i think we’re having to try and
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: figure out how we do that and
can public spaces be programmed specifically for congregation
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: and what does that mean for a
community’s identity what does that mean for mental
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: health and what
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: also does what does that mean for
communities at are trying to get into the
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: innovation or advancing in the innovation economy
when so much of
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: what is created in that innovation economy
is by people
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[jackie_mandyck]: m
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: who like to collaborate who like things
sort of mashing together and build off of
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: each other’s energy um so it does
a city and does the public space in
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: the city hell facilitate that so those
are a handful things that i think of
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: changed the other things that have changed
i think is we’ve all learned now that
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: we don’t have to necessarily live right
next to next door to our to the
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: offices and then the office is becoming
a ah there’s a different definition of the
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: office and that’s
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: e’re still figuring that out but the
idea of you know you used to be
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: able to you know bring your own
laptop to the office bring your own phone
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: and now i think we’re at the
stage of were bring your own city which
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: is a sort of a section in
the book
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[paul_tyler]: jackie
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: how has your how is how is
this whole experience of the last couple years
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[paul_tyler]: shape your
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[paul_tyler]: vision of what hartford should be could
be five ten years from now
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah i think you know what covid
has taught us is the importance of the
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[jackie_mandyck]: quality of place so it’s very important
now
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: i
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[jackie_mandyck]: for cities and for regions to really
look at what what is being offered to
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[jackie_mandyck]: the people who live in
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: this town and who work in this
town and that comes from you know a
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[jackie_mandyck]: lot of recreational amenities that people might
have
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: transportation modes of transportation and not just
transportation
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: mobility how do you get from one
place to the other you know we saw
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[jackie_mandyck]: in two and a half years during
covid you know tremendous amount of people wanting
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[jackie_mandyck]: to do things outdoors and how do
you start to look at things that people
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[jackie_mandyck]: can do outdoors either by gathering or
move ving or finding some
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: sense of activity
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[paul_tyler]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: community in an outdoor setting so i
think the quality of place issue has just
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[jackie_mandyck]: been heightened it’s always been
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: there but it’s been heightened over the
last two and a half years and with
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[jackie_mandyck]: remote work it even becomes greater than
that because as you’re trying to hire people
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[jackie_mandyck]: in the insurance industry if you’ve got
a really good candidate they don’t necessarily
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[paul_tyler]: m
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[jackie_mandyck]: in some positions have to be located
in the of hartford or in any other
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[jackie_mandyck]: type of region they can work remotely
to whatever extent that the job allows for
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[jackie_mandyck]: that to happen really looking and focusing
on our region and what we offer is
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[jackie_mandyck]: really important going forward and and how
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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[jackie_mandyck]: we in vision things and i think
to paul’s point it’s almost like you have
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[jackie_mandyck]: to
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: create the sets or the designs for
people to have more of an intentional interaction
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[jackie_mandyck]: and i think that’s
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: very important going forward
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: that creative place making process that you
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[paul_tyler]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: go through to try and build community
is very
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: important because quality of place not only
includes your amenities that are around you but
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[jackie_mandyck]: it’s that vibe that you get when
you’re talking people and talking to the community
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[jackie_mandyck]: and it’s being part of that community
that’s so important
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[laura_dinan_haber]: jack you talk about quality of place
and paul you as well
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[paul_tyler]: m
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[laura_dinan_haber]: how do you manage the conversation around
quality of place because i imagine from a
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[laura_dinan_haber]: residence perspective versus a corporate versus maybe
a state level perspective people define that differently
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[laura_dinan_haber]: so if i’m working in downtown hartford
on mondays and tuesdays from eight thirty to
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[laura_dinan_haber]: five does my perception or my definition
of quality of place or the things that
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[laura_dinan_haber]: i do you
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[laura_dinan_haber]: as individuals who are seeking to build
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[laura_dinan_haber]: and provide these innovated places within cities
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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[laura_dinan_haber]: do you take varying perspectives into the
equation when say building a space that has
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[laura_dinan_haber]: to be more communal or it’s looking
to bring individuals together for innovation how do
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[laura_dinan_haber]: you take that into consideration because i
imagine
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
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[laura_dinan_haber]: you have various players at the table
defining that only quality of place but there
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[laura_dinan_haber]: so using that place differently
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: absolutely and you know it’s not just
about what’s around the corner or what’s next
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[jackie_mandyck]: door to the building that you work
in or where you live if you look
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[jackie_mandyck]: at the city of
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: ye
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: hartford i can be skeeing into our
or i could be down in the beach
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[jackie_mandyck]: in an hour i could
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: be to boston
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[paul_tyler]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: or i could be new york the
quality of place doesn’t have to necessarily mean
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[jackie_mandyck]: what’s right outside your door it could
be your location as far as what you
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[jackie_mandyck]: can get to is well so it
all kind of comes in laura to make
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: this no fabulous mix or recipe that
equal success for any kind of place based
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[jackie_mandyck]: initiative
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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[jackie_mandyck]: or entity of
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: where we are place where we are
so i think you know it really depends
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[jackie_mandyck]: upon what you’re
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: trying to create in your community i
think at the heart and the core of
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[jackie_mandyck]: it is you want things that brings
community together
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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[jackie_mandyck]: that highlights their senses
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: you know it goes back to those
five senses you know what can you try
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[jackie_mandyck]: and create that
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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[jackie_mandyck]: really impacts and makes
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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[jackie_mandyck]: an impact on an individual using their
senses and you know looking at how and
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[jackie_mandyck]: what they want as far as an
experience of where they live in yet
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: i’m glad jackie took the first run
at that answer because i was struggling as
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: you as you asked the question but
i’ve had time to think
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[paul_tyler]: m
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: i think public space should
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[jackie_mandyck]: yes
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: be something that’s very fluid and a
few examples you know years ago public it
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: base meant sort of landscaping bench and
so during the day in the sun you
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: could sit on the bench and that
would be one experience and then at night
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: you could sit on the bench and
night that would be another experience but that
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: was about you know the difference of
it but now i think good
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[jackie_mandyck]: yes
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: he whole practice of designing public spaces
is evolved greatly and some of the core
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00:13:32,279 –> 00:13:36,125
[paul_kalbfleisch]: aspects of it is it should be
engaging there should be things that that that
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: people engage with we were all now
most of us have grown up with the
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: idea of steam parks and so our
expectations of public space is evolved the bench
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: is now higher we want things that
we can engage in we want things um
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: as we participate
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[jackie_mandyck]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: in it we are helping to create
the experience the nice thing about that is
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: that you know the
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: spaces show
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[paul_tyler]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: if people
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[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: are a key ingredient in what happens
in the space then then as the audience
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[jackie_mandyck]: a
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: changes into the evening from the audience
that was there say at lunch to compared
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00:14:15,617 –> 00:14:19,604
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to the audience that was there mid
afternoon the experience should be different as well
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: and good public space design is starting
to follow that so that
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00:14:26,430 –> 00:14:26,450
[paul_tyler]: m
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00:14:26,956 –> 00:14:30,742
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you know we should go down there
tonight because it’s different on fridays and it
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00:14:30,802 –> 00:14:36,051
[paul_kalbfleisch]: is on saturday afternoon just by the
nature of how people engage and then
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[paul_tyler]: m
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00:14:36,071 –> 00:14:39,957
[paul_kalbfleisch]: there’s also the aspect of well designed
public space should be
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00:14:40,050 –> 00:14:40,920
[paul_tyler]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: have areas where people to be fully
involved in it but also passive areas where
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00:14:45,527 –> 00:14:50,471
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you can sit be just the an
audience watching that and if you think of
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00:14:50,531 –> 00:14:54,478
[paul_kalbfleisch]: a european square you know you have
the center of it where you know something
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00:14:54,738 –> 00:14:58,304
[paul_kalbfleisch]: is going on and it’s all active
but then you have the sort of surrounding
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00:14:58,404 –> 00:15:01,750
[paul_kalbfleisch]: areas around the edges where people can
just sit have a have a glass of
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[paul_tyler]: yeah
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00:15:02,111 –> 00:15:04,354
[paul_kalbfleisch]: wine and participate in so
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00:15:05,190 –> 00:15:06,180
[paul_tyler]: oh
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00:15:05,296 –> 00:15:08,241
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i think the idea of public space
is no longer
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00:15:08,550 –> 00:15:08,570
[paul_tyler]: m
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: static
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[jackie_mandyck]: oh
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[paul_kalbfleisch]: it is it’s job should be too
fully and completely
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00:15:15,870 –> 00:15:16,014
[paul_tyler]: yeah
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00:15:17,588 –> 00:15:22,313
[paul_kalbfleisch]: evolve ased on how people engage with
it and you need to design it so
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00:15:22,393 –> 00:15:23,454
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that there are those doors
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00:15:23,220 –> 00:15:24,210
[paul_tyler]: yeah
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00:15:23,554 –> 00:15:24,816
[paul_kalbfleisch]: open for people to engage
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00:15:24,810 –> 00:15:25,110
[paul_tyler]: yeah
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00:15:24,876 –> 00:15:25,137
[paul_kalbfleisch]: with it
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00:15:26,491 –> 00:15:31,235
[paul_tyler]: jackie and i think i think about
a mission we a lot of us have
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00:15:31,275 –> 00:15:37,992
[paul_tyler]: had which is hey let’s bring innovation
to hartford and the companies currance companies
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00:15:38,068 –> 00:15:38,998
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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00:15:38,373 –> 00:15:44,460
[paul_tyler]: who are here now prepandemic you know
interesting paul to your point which is where’s
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00:15:44,540 –> 00:15:46,664
[paul_tyler]: there and it was
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00:15:46,492 –> 00:15:46,513
[jackie_mandyck]: m
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00:15:46,744 –> 00:15:47,045
[paul_tyler]: very
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00:15:47,437 –> 00:15:47,458
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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00:15:47,646 –> 00:15:53,937
[paul_tyler]: temporal and it was very fluid you
know we had uh had hired a
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00:15:54,703 –> 00:15:54,949
[jackie_mandyck]: mah
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00:15:55,690 –> 00:15:58,973
[paul_tyler]: start a camp to run an incubator
well you had periods of time where we
332
00:15:59,073 –> 00:16:04,258
[paul_tyler]: pulled all these people from different companies
into this one space you know end of
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00:16:04,778 –> 00:16:05,379
[paul_tyler]: three four or five
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00:16:05,428 –> 00:16:05,693
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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00:16:05,439 –> 00:16:07,061
[paul_tyler]: months it’s vacant
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00:16:07,408 –> 00:16:07,630
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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00:16:08,483 –> 00:16:11,187
[paul_tyler]: we have events in our building jackie
at specific times
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00:16:11,428 –> 00:16:12,298
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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00:16:11,508 –> 00:16:13,852
[paul_tyler]: we’ve had you stacy has been pulling
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00:16:13,888 –> 00:16:15,718
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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00:16:13,912 –> 00:16:15,635
[paul_tyler]: events in the convention center
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00:16:15,748 –> 00:16:16,090
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
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00:16:15,815 –> 00:16:20,102
[paul_tyler]: is if we we kind of double
ten to insurance is it really going to
344
00:16:20,142 –> 00:16:27,615
[paul_tyler]: be event folk event driven public space
that will be critical for innovation going you
345
00:16:27,695 –> 00:16:28,536
[paul_tyler]: know forward
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00:16:28,288 –> 00:16:29,755
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ye
347
00:16:30,740 –> 00:16:33,924
[paul_tyler]: you know is it ever going to
go back to be in the coffee shop
348
00:16:34,064 –> 00:16:38,389
[paul_tyler]: you know where you know everybody runs
into everybody who is getting coffee during lunch
349
00:16:42,418 –> 00:16:42,868
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
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00:16:42,584 –> 00:16:42,886
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
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00:16:43,438 –> 00:16:43,458
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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00:16:43,531 –> 00:16:44,437
[jackie_mandyck]: um you know
353
00:16:45,088 –> 00:16:45,330
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
354
00:16:47,003 –> 00:16:49,288
[jackie_mandyck]: you can’t give me a lay up
question here can you paul
355
00:16:49,380 –> 00:16:49,480
[paul_tyler]: no
356
00:16:49,388 –> 00:16:50,751
[jackie_mandyck]: you have to really make
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00:16:50,644 –> 00:16:50,945
[paul_tyler]: you have
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00:16:50,831 –> 00:16:50,891
[jackie_mandyck]: it
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00:16:50,985 –> 00:16:51,527
[paul_tyler]: the answers
360
00:16:51,569 –> 00:16:51,650
[paul_kalbfleisch]: no
361
00:16:51,588 –> 00:16:52,069
[paul_tyler]: jackie
362
00:16:51,973 –> 00:16:52,256
[jackie_mandyck]: yes
363
00:16:52,109 –> 00:16:52,912
[paul_tyler]: you have the plan
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00:16:52,690 –> 00:16:52,771
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
365
00:16:52,923 –> 00:16:53,063
[jackie_mandyck]: all
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00:16:53,153 –> 00:16:53,474
[paul_tyler]: master
367
00:16:53,504 –> 00:16:53,624
[jackie_mandyck]: all
368
00:16:53,534 –> 00:16:53,775
[paul_tyler]: plan
369
00:16:53,684 –> 00:16:56,389
[jackie_mandyck]: of them all of them you know
i think it’s a combination
370
00:16:56,248 –> 00:16:56,998
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
371
00:16:56,590 –> 00:16:56,710
[jackie_mandyck]: so
372
00:16:57,330 –> 00:16:57,350
[paul_tyler]: m
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00:16:58,443 –> 00:16:59,244
[jackie_mandyck]: think about when we’re
374
00:16:59,259 –> 00:16:59,280
[paul_tyler]: m
375
00:16:59,284 –> 00:17:03,611
[jackie_mandyck]: the most creative you know when you
say innovative i think creative so you know
376
00:17:04,984 –> 00:17:09,070
[jackie_mandyck]: to me it’s it’s the same thing
it’s that creative juice and gets that flowing
377
00:17:09,131 –> 00:17:15,521
[jackie_mandyck]: and different things motivate people either business
personally may be an artist
378
00:17:16,410 –> 00:17:16,713
[paul_tyler]: yeah
379
00:17:16,463 –> 00:17:22,870
[jackie_mandyck]: you have to have certain settings to
be able to create
380
00:17:22,477 –> 00:17:22,498
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
381
00:17:23,030 –> 00:17:28,659
[jackie_mandyck]: and to be innovative and i think
you know sometimes that is
382
00:17:28,627 –> 00:17:28,648
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
383
00:17:28,799 –> 00:17:34,403
[jackie_mandyck]: like the traditionally conference type of space
yes
384
00:17:34,430 –> 00:17:34,657
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yes
385
00:17:34,743 –> 00:17:39,469
[jackie_mandyck]: some of it might be me running
in to laura and having a conversation about
386
00:17:39,509 –> 00:17:43,714
[jackie_mandyck]: our kids that eventually evolves over to
my gosh
387
00:17:43,558 –> 00:17:44,248
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
388
00:17:43,854 –> 00:17:46,839
[jackie_mandyck]: we’re doing this at work and we’re
doing that and oh you should really talk
389
00:17:46,919 –> 00:17:49,563
[jackie_mandyck]: to so and so it’s that it’s
that
390
00:17:49,529 –> 00:17:49,630
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
391
00:17:49,643 –> 00:17:54,712
[jackie_mandyck]: by chance it’s that creative juice and
i think what happens in spaces at least
392
00:17:54,752 –> 00:17:58,676
[jackie_mandyck]: this is what happens to me it’s
kind of like the snowball effect going
393
00:17:58,507 –> 00:17:58,528
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
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00:17:58,736 –> 00:18:02,823
[jackie_mandyck]: down the hill so once you can
start the snowball going down the hill and
395
00:18:02,863 –> 00:18:04,145
[jackie_mandyck]: you start to
396
00:18:04,228 –> 00:18:05,038
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
397
00:18:04,285 –> 00:18:04,986
[jackie_mandyck]: figure out
398
00:18:05,098 –> 00:18:05,380
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
399
00:18:05,648 –> 00:18:09,514
[jackie_mandyck]: how to build that snowball it just
start to land slide down
400
00:18:09,441 –> 00:18:10,078
[paul_kalbfleisch]: right
401
00:18:09,554 –> 00:18:18,229
[jackie_mandyck]: and that’s what creates the more innovative
approaches to things the thought design the business
402
00:18:18,349 –> 00:18:20,312
[jackie_mandyck]: lines and i think
403
00:18:20,248 –> 00:18:21,448
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
404
00:18:20,372 –> 00:18:25,981
[jackie_mandyck]: to foster that in any type of
location is exactly what you want you want
405
00:18:26,022 –> 00:18:32,332
[jackie_mandyck]: to create spaces and put people together
intentionally or not intentionally but the spaces can
406
00:18:32,432 –> 00:18:35,357
[jackie_mandyck]: help you do that um that creates
407
00:18:35,287 –> 00:18:35,308
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
408
00:18:35,598 –> 00:18:40,646
[jackie_mandyck]: that kind of thinking that creativity um
that thought process
409
00:18:40,567 –> 00:18:40,588
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
410
00:18:40,706 –> 00:18:42,769
[jackie_mandyck]: and so i think whether it be
a convention
411
00:18:42,703 –> 00:18:42,786
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
412
00:18:42,950 –> 00:18:49,360
[jackie_mandyck]: or whether it be just spaces where
people gather that you can then start those
413
00:18:49,421 –> 00:18:50,362
[jackie_mandyck]: conversations
414
00:18:50,728 –> 00:18:51,175
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
415
00:18:50,903 –> 00:18:51,945
[jackie_mandyck]: or that thought process
416
00:18:51,570 –> 00:18:52,937
[paul_tyler]: yeah yes
417
00:18:52,946 –> 00:18:53,487
[jackie_mandyck]: that helps
418
00:18:53,390 –> 00:18:53,410
[paul_kalbfleisch]: a
419
00:18:53,868 –> 00:18:55,431
[jackie_mandyck]: that helps it in any kind
420
00:18:55,350 –> 00:18:55,370
[paul_tyler]: m
421
00:18:55,571 –> 00:18:59,261
[jackie_mandyck]: of urban city environment i mean really
anywhere
422
00:19:00,808 –> 00:19:08,496
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you know i think city environments should
start to be designed with the creative mind
423
00:19:08,796 –> 00:19:15,836
[paul_kalbfleisch]: in mind so let me walk through
what does that mean um the innovators the
424
00:19:15,897 –> 00:19:20,184
[paul_kalbfleisch]: creative minds whatever you know whatever phrase
you want to put to it how do
425
00:19:20,244 –> 00:19:27,667
[paul_kalbfleisch]: those minds work they never stop they’re
constantly thinking running around thinking about thinking about
426
00:19:27,727 –> 00:19:32,455
[paul_kalbfleisch]: think about it now i’m supposedly a
creative person and i don’t mind saying sometimes
427
00:19:32,575 –> 00:19:37,255
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i build my clients for the times
outrunning because that’s where the thinking happened so
428
00:19:37,988 –> 00:19:42,879
[paul_kalbfleisch]: sorry i’m not at a desk but
i’m doing that so their minds are always
429
00:19:42,999 –> 00:19:46,923
[paul_kalbfleisch]: moving their minds are always thinking they
don’t shut off just because
430
00:19:46,800 –> 00:19:47,460
[paul_tyler]: yah
431
00:19:46,964 –> 00:19:54,122
[paul_kalbfleisch]: they’ve gone through a door and so
the stimulus that they want and require should
432
00:19:54,603 –> 00:19:59,831
[paul_kalbfleisch]: should be constantly evolving so space should
be designed public space should be designed so
433
00:19:59,892 –> 00:20:03,457
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that may be the outside of a
building has some interesting engaging
434
00:20:03,185 –> 00:20:03,205
[jackie_mandyck]: a
435
00:20:03,598 –> 00:20:07,711
[paul_kalbfleisch]: public art or something but it doesn’t
stop because you walk through the lobby and
436
00:20:07,772 –> 00:20:14,079
[paul_kalbfleisch]: it doesn’t necessarily stop you know it
sort of evolves everywhere and the other things
437
00:20:14,119 –> 00:20:15,381
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that these creative minds
438
00:20:15,690 –> 00:20:15,710
[paul_tyler]: m
439
00:20:16,343 –> 00:20:21,211
[paul_kalbfleisch]: so public space should be always on
just like these minds are are always on
440
00:20:22,533 –> 00:20:26,740
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and it should be you know to
what jackie was talking about the chance to
441
00:20:26,900 –> 00:20:34,292
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to mash together to mash people together
to mash ideas together is very very important
442
00:20:34,333 –> 00:20:38,459
[paul_kalbfleisch]: because creative minds you know they’re looking
very were far to the right and the
443
00:20:38,520 –> 00:20:42,326
[paul_kalbfleisch]: left and saying holy macora we connected
those two things we got something we got
444
00:20:42,366 –> 00:20:46,553
[paul_kalbfleisch]: something new and so public space should
reflect that my chance to sort of bump
445
00:20:46,673 –> 00:20:51,841
[paul_kalbfleisch]: into people my chance to be to
put artist engine and then engineer together just
446
00:20:51,921 –> 00:20:58,018
[paul_kalbfleisch]: because they’re near by oh my gosh
what would at whatever happen you have to
447
00:20:58,078 –> 00:21:01,865
[paul_kalbfleisch]: program things that way because that’s the
way the creative mind works and you’re trying
448
00:21:01,965 –> 00:21:06,452
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to leverage and accentuate that creative process
most
449
00:21:06,450 –> 00:21:07,650
[paul_tyler]: yeah
450
00:21:06,512 –> 00:21:10,499
[paul_kalbfleisch]: of the times if you’re if you
want to you know support in ation and
451
00:21:10,519 –> 00:21:14,264
[paul_kalbfleisch]: then the other thing that is i
think is important to acknowledge with the creative
452
00:21:14,109 –> 00:21:14,130
[paul_tyler]: m
453
00:21:14,444 –> 00:21:22,168
[paul_kalbfleisch]: mind is that’s exhausting um it’s hard
it uses up a lot of energy be
454
00:21:22,368 –> 00:21:27,477
[paul_kalbfleisch]: trying to think of new things so
if you can create environments that are stimulating
455
00:21:27,537 –> 00:21:33,447
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that sort of you know re inject
energy into their into these people it’s really
456
00:21:33,507 –> 00:21:37,053
[paul_kalbfleisch]: really great important and so sometimes it’s
almost like you got to think it’s it’s
457
00:21:37,473 –> 00:21:42,021
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the exact opposite of the cubicle you
know it’s it’s now you want noise you
458
00:21:42,121 –> 00:21:45,787
[paul_kalbfleisch]: want you wanted all of these things
because you’re dealing with you know
459
00:21:45,870 –> 00:21:46,092
[paul_tyler]: oh
460
00:21:45,968 –> 00:21:49,574
[paul_kalbfleisch]: different type of mind not a mind
that kind of goes to straight forward of
461
00:21:49,634 –> 00:21:53,440
[paul_kalbfleisch]: mind that goes more like this back
and forth on i don’t know if people
462
00:21:53,263 –> 00:21:53,570
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
463
00:21:53,500 –> 00:21:57,767
[paul_kalbfleisch]: are seeing the videos of my hands
waving around or not but it’s quite spectacular
464
00:21:57,698 –> 00:21:58,301
[laura_dinan_haber]: oh
465
00:21:57,807 –> 00:22:00,953
[paul_kalbfleisch]: right um so i
466
00:22:00,943 –> 00:22:01,148
[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
467
00:22:01,013 –> 00:22:05,079
[paul_kalbfleisch]: think that’s that that sort of that’s
that’s another way of looking at what jackie
468
00:22:05,099 –> 00:22:06,101
[paul_kalbfleisch]: was talking about is
469
00:22:06,493 –> 00:22:07,153
[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
470
00:22:06,562 –> 00:22:15,069
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you know designing space to facilitate what
the creative mind does in designing space re
471
00:22:15,170 –> 00:22:17,544
[paul_kalbfleisch]: injects energy into the creative mind
472
00:22:17,654 –> 00:22:20,643
[jackie_mandyck]: and i think paul brings up a
great point and i guess i throw this
473
00:22:20,683 –> 00:22:22,669
[jackie_mandyck]: back at you laura and paul
474
00:22:22,738 –> 00:22:23,518
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
475
00:22:23,893 –> 00:22:28,934
[jackie_mandyck]: sit there and say you know in
the insurance industry or in any business how
476
00:22:29,235 –> 00:22:29,657
[jackie_mandyck]: are we
477
00:22:30,488 –> 00:22:30,753
[laura_dinan_haber]: oh
478
00:22:31,523 –> 00:22:33,867
[jackie_mandyck]: giving those types of experiences
479
00:22:33,432 –> 00:22:34,088
[laura_dinan_haber]: okay
480
00:22:34,007 –> 00:22:40,137
[jackie_mandyck]: to our employees to allow that creativity
and that innovation to occur within your industry
481
00:22:40,939 –> 00:22:45,985
[jackie_mandyck]: so where paul and i are saying
you know they need to get out they
482
00:22:46,045 –> 00:22:49,210
[jackie_mandyck]: need to look they need to talk
they need to smell they need to
483
00:22:49,140 –> 00:22:49,382
[paul_tyler]: yeah
484
00:22:49,932 –> 00:22:54,239
[jackie_mandyck]: you now find those creative you know
it’s he’s
485
00:22:54,282 –> 00:22:54,364
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
486
00:22:54,339 –> 00:22:57,985
[jackie_mandyck]: right it’s very tough to maintain the
creativity and trying
487
00:22:58,069 –> 00:22:58,312
[paul_kalbfleisch]: okay
488
00:22:58,205 –> 00:23:03,114
[jackie_mandyck]: always evolve but how do you do
that i think you know greater hartford can
489
00:23:03,254 –> 00:23:08,362
[jackie_mandyck]: only benefit from companies who allow their
employees to seek out these
490
00:23:08,222 –> 00:23:08,284
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
491
00:23:09,103 –> 00:23:10,174
[jackie_mandyck]: experiences
492
00:23:09,688 –> 00:23:10,378
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
493
00:23:11,223 –> 00:23:17,072
[jackie_mandyck]: that helps get the juices flowing that
helps move about the creativity because if somebody
494
00:23:17,313 –> 00:23:18,936
[jackie_mandyck]: is enjoying
495
00:23:18,990 –> 00:23:19,710
[paul_tyler]: oh
496
00:23:19,096 –> 00:23:21,560
[jackie_mandyck]: creative place making or looking at what
an artist
497
00:23:21,659 –> 00:23:22,228
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
498
00:23:21,660 –> 00:23:22,542
[jackie_mandyck]: might do that
499
00:23:22,560 –> 00:23:22,824
[paul_tyler]: oh
500
00:23:22,602 –> 00:23:25,887
[jackie_mandyck]: might in fire them to look at
things a little differently
501
00:23:25,778 –> 00:23:25,984
[laura_dinan_haber]: oh
502
00:23:25,859 –> 00:23:25,960
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
503
00:23:26,348 –> 00:23:29,413
[jackie_mandyck]: even in the insurance business where you’re
504
00:23:29,308 –> 00:23:29,998
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
505
00:23:29,433 –> 00:23:31,957
[jackie_mandyck]: talking about a lot of actuaries
506
00:23:31,020 –> 00:23:31,263
[paul_tyler]: oh
507
00:23:32,057 –> 00:23:34,481
[jackie_mandyck]: and numbers and everything else
508
00:23:34,829 –> 00:23:34,931
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
509
00:23:35,163 –> 00:23:36,665
[jackie_mandyck]: but i guess i throw it back
at you what do
510
00:23:36,810 –> 00:23:37,560
[paul_tyler]: oh
511
00:23:36,865 –> 00:23:42,715
[jackie_mandyck]: you think businesses need to do to
be able to utilize this growing
512
00:23:42,420 –> 00:23:42,664
[paul_tyler]: oh
513
00:23:42,936 –> 00:23:44,979
[jackie_mandyck]: movement of creative place making in
514
00:23:45,045 –> 00:23:45,106
[paul_tyler]: ah
515
00:23:45,099 –> 00:23:48,550
[jackie_mandyck]: cities to really benefit you organization s
in your companies
516
00:23:50,530 –> 00:23:50,790
[paul_tyler]: laura
517
00:23:50,668 –> 00:23:51,298
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
518
00:23:51,853 –> 00:23:52,963
[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
519
00:23:52,078 –> 00:23:52,259
[laura_dinan_haber]: i was
520
00:23:52,168 –> 00:23:52,395
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
521
00:23:52,279 –> 00:23:55,724
[laura_dinan_haber]: going to say paul this is the
perfect segued for you i’m going to kick
522
00:23:55,744 –> 00:23:56,906
[laura_dinan_haber]: it over to you in a second
to talk
523
00:23:56,850 –> 00:23:57,870
[paul_tyler]: yeah
524
00:23:56,987 –> 00:24:00,272
[laura_dinan_haber]: about the work that you did with
the science center in the partnership there
525
00:24:00,180 –> 00:24:00,444
[paul_tyler]: oh
526
00:24:00,332 –> 00:24:04,759
[laura_dinan_haber]: but for me i think we have
an opportunity in a previous call we talked
527
00:24:04,780 –> 00:24:04,820
[laura_dinan_haber]: a
528
00:24:04,800 –> 00:24:05,919
[paul_tyler]: yeah
529
00:24:04,860 –> 00:24:07,424
[laura_dinan_haber]: lot about how we don’t tell our
story
530
00:24:07,528 –> 00:24:08,278
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
531
00:24:07,825 –> 00:24:12,012
[laura_dinan_haber]: enough or we don’t tell our story
in a way that can truly inspire others
532
00:24:12,092 –> 00:24:15,998
[laura_dinan_haber]: so talking about our building for example
we have a two sided build it’s
533
00:24:15,898 –> 00:24:16,140
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
534
00:24:16,078 –> 00:24:18,643
[laura_dinan_haber]: on the historic registry it’s really
535
00:24:18,628 –> 00:24:18,916
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yes
536
00:24:19,123 –> 00:24:21,087
[laura_dinan_haber]: cool in a lot of ways so
537
00:24:21,120 –> 00:24:21,464
[paul_tyler]: oh
538
00:24:21,187 –> 00:24:24,092
[laura_dinan_haber]: for me it’s you know what can
we do to get our employes jazzed up
539
00:24:24,152 –> 00:24:27,958
[laura_dinan_haber]: what can we do to show the
community that we are innovative we are there
540
00:24:28,279 –> 00:24:30,402
[laura_dinan_haber]: you know why don’t why aren’t we
image mapping our building
541
00:24:30,600 –> 00:24:30,865
[paul_tyler]: oh
542
00:24:30,743 –> 00:24:34,529
[laura_dinan_haber]: why aren’t we at night showing and
projecting images into that space and using it
543
00:24:34,649 –> 00:24:37,214
[laura_dinan_haber]: as an opportunity to either share messages
544
00:24:36,928 –> 00:24:37,777
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yea
545
00:24:37,354 –> 00:24:41,521
[laura_dinan_haber]: or bring the community together i know
that we’re working with chitmccave and jordan pollen
546
00:24:41,581 –> 00:24:45,848
[laura_dinan_haber]: over the bed and we’re actually sponsoring
a movie series that they’re doing spooky pop
547
00:24:45,928 –> 00:24:50,556
[laura_dinan_haber]: corn to get people up onto constitution
plaza to activate that space in a way
548
00:24:50,616 –> 00:24:51,037
[laura_dinan_haber]: where people
549
00:24:51,038 –> 00:24:51,221
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
550
00:24:51,097 –> 00:24:56,746
[laura_dinan_haber]: will be out together during the evenings
around the halloween season watching scary movies you
551
00:24:56,786 –> 00:25:00,813
[laura_dinan_haber]: know that’s just fun for us but
using not only the physical space but the
552
00:25:00,853 –> 00:25:04,940
[laura_dinan_haber]: opportunity like you said jackie having employers
employees get out there
553
00:25:04,890 –> 00:25:04,910
[paul_tyler]: m
554
00:25:05,008 –> 00:25:05,150
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
555
00:25:05,060 –> 00:25:09,007
[laura_dinan_haber]: be creative and i think at naso
we’re lucky in that we do have that
556
00:25:09,107 –> 00:25:12,492
[laura_dinan_haber]: creative freedom where you know paul is
not going to look for me at my
557
00:25:13,113 –> 00:25:15,337
[laura_dinan_haber]: my cubicle to say laura where are
you you should
558
00:25:15,358 –> 00:25:15,641
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
559
00:25:15,377 –> 00:25:15,958
[laura_dinan_haber]: be to your
560
00:25:15,930 –> 00:25:16,590
[paul_tyler]: yeah
561
00:25:16,038 –> 00:25:16,339
[laura_dinan_haber]: chair
562
00:25:16,680 –> 00:25:16,700
[paul_tyler]: m
563
00:25:16,800 –> 00:25:21,047
[laura_dinan_haber]: if i’m out walking across the bridge
and i’m enjoying the park down by river
564
00:25:21,107 –> 00:25:24,893
[laura_dinan_haber]: front recapture or if i’m sitting in
some of those you know uh
565
00:25:25,288 –> 00:25:25,711
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
566
00:25:25,334 –> 00:25:25,975
[laura_dinan_haber]: auditorium or
567
00:25:26,010 –> 00:25:26,610
[paul_tyler]: may
568
00:25:26,095 –> 00:25:29,781
[laura_dinan_haber]: stadium style chairs just watch people row
down the river i can go do those
569
00:25:29,861 –> 00:25:34,669
[laura_dinan_haber]: things i can walk the city get
inspiration because it’s okay and that’s the message
570
00:25:34,749 –> 00:25:38,355
[laura_dinan_haber]: to the employees if you need to
get out to think because i too paul
571
00:25:38,396 –> 00:25:42,723
[laura_dinan_haber]: you know i like to be active
when i am the most creative sitting like
572
00:25:42,743 –> 00:25:46,469
[laura_dinan_haber]: a potato does nothing for me but
if i am out doing something that’s for
573
00:25:46,529 –> 00:25:46,609
[laura_dinan_haber]: me
574
00:25:46,586 –> 00:25:46,606
[paul_tyler]: i
575
00:25:46,689 –> 00:25:49,975
[laura_dinan_haber]: when when things happen so going back
to kind of the question
576
00:25:50,220 –> 00:25:50,421
[paul_tyler]: oh
577
00:25:50,396 –> 00:25:53,661
[laura_dinan_haber]: you know i think that there are
opportunities and using physical space to
578
00:25:54,240 –> 00:25:54,260
[paul_tyler]: m
579
00:25:54,322 –> 00:25:58,028
[laura_dinan_haber]: activate ideas and you know maybe it’s
a challenge on us paul to use our
580
00:25:58,068 –> 00:26:02,576
[laura_dinan_haber]: building in creative ways to get that
out there but why don’t you share what
581
00:26:02,616 –> 00:26:05,232
[laura_dinan_haber]: we did with the science or in
the work you put together
582
00:26:05,100 –> 00:26:08,706
[paul_tyler]: yeah yeah sure sure before i can
get there paul you know there’s a section
583
00:26:08,766 –> 00:26:15,056
[paul_tyler]: in your book where you talk about
celebration and that that really struck home for
584
00:26:14,977 –> 00:26:14,998
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
585
00:26:15,116 –> 00:26:15,196
[paul_tyler]: me
586
00:26:15,358 –> 00:26:15,599
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
587
00:26:15,597 –> 00:26:20,007
[paul_tyler]: which is if i’m gonna paraphrase it
you say you
588
00:26:20,010 –> 00:26:20,215
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
589
00:26:20,047 –> 00:26:24,514
[paul_tyler]: know you attract what you celebrate and
i
590
00:26:24,488 –> 00:26:24,648
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
591
00:26:24,534 –> 00:26:27,600
[paul_tyler]: think i think jackie that’s probably the
most important thing i think we can do
592
00:26:27,660 –> 00:26:34,373
[paul_tyler]: inside companies to celebrate successes you know
what is innovation you know it sometimes you
593
00:26:34,393 –> 00:26:40,186
[paul_tyler]: know they’re big novativethings sumtimes there really
small things that are really innovative and laura
594
00:26:40,647 –> 00:26:45,535
[paul_tyler]: has got this and i’ve written this
down l laura is her
595
00:26:45,523 –> 00:26:46,010
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
596
00:26:45,575 –> 00:26:48,440
[paul_tyler]: mission she’s gotten some senior people on
board to sort
597
00:26:48,319 –> 00:26:48,339
[paul_kalbfleisch]: a
598
00:26:48,344 –> 00:26:48,425
[jackie_mandyck]: ye
599
00:26:48,480 –> 00:26:53,849
[paul_tyler]: of celebrate innovation inside of our company
i think you know it’s harder than you’d
600
00:26:53,969 –> 00:26:58,437
[paul_tyler]: think to kind of get that that
ball rolling but i think the biggest thing
601
00:26:58,477 –> 00:27:03,205
[paul_tyler]: we can do is is publicly sell
lebrate when our employees do something different make
602
00:27:03,505 –> 00:27:07,993
[paul_tyler]: make make a change and i think
that’s internal i think outside it’s an interesting
603
00:27:08,774 –> 00:27:09,415
[paul_tyler]: question which
604
00:27:09,508 –> 00:27:10,408
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
605
00:27:09,936 –> 00:27:15,731
[paul_tyler]: you know what laura was talking about
was a no ship where we renewed
606
00:27:15,358 –> 00:27:15,603
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yes
607
00:27:15,891 –> 00:27:17,393
[paul_tyler]: a collaboration with a science center
608
00:27:17,268 –> 00:27:17,369
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
609
00:27:17,494 –> 00:27:24,245
[paul_tyler]: and it’s great program you know matt
we’ve got some terrific partnership over the built
610
00:27:24,305 –> 00:27:26,048
[paul_tyler]: over the last couple of years as
well with our
611
00:27:26,218 –> 00:27:26,481
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
612
00:27:26,509 –> 00:27:30,355
[paul_tyler]: incubator and in their team but
613
00:27:30,732 –> 00:27:30,794
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
614
00:27:31,357 –> 00:27:32,759
[paul_tyler]: you know we we we sort
615
00:27:32,677 –> 00:27:32,698
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
616
00:27:32,819 –> 00:27:37,467
[paul_tyler]: of re defined a space virtually you
know i think policy sent you a clip
617
00:27:37,547 –> 00:27:38,929
[paul_tyler]: here using
618
00:27:39,011 –> 00:27:39,092
[jackie_mandyck]: ah
619
00:27:39,245 –> 00:27:39,838
[paul_kalbfleisch]: hm
620
00:27:39,310 –> 00:27:43,918
[paul_tyler]: augmented reality because you know unfortunately if
you want to re design a space jackie
621
00:27:43,998 –> 00:27:50,328
[paul_tyler]: how long does this take wow you
know planning cost expense is the way to
622
00:27:50,428 –> 00:27:50,529
[paul_tyler]: use
623
00:27:50,617 –> 00:27:50,638
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
624
00:27:50,629 –> 00:27:52,812
[paul_tyler]: technol g to sort of create those
625
00:27:52,603 –> 00:27:52,623
[jackie_mandyck]: m
626
00:27:53,393 –> 00:28:00,193
[paul_tyler]: external re define the those external environments
in a way that helps drive that collaboration
627
00:28:00,654 –> 00:28:03,759
[paul_tyler]: you want i think there’s a lot
more we can do jackie with that in
628
00:28:03,839 –> 00:28:04,680
[paul_tyler]: our community
629
00:28:04,421 –> 00:28:04,503
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
630
00:28:04,721 –> 00:28:09,028
[paul_tyler]: especially with the insurance and the insurance
sector so long would an answer but i
631
00:28:09,068 –> 00:28:12,796
[paul_tyler]: think one is celebrate celebrate celebrate celebrate
by the way lord you know we should
632
00:28:13,357 –> 00:28:13,798
[paul_tyler]: weshudprobably have
633
00:28:13,702 –> 00:28:13,784
[jackie_mandyck]: as
634
00:28:13,838 –> 00:28:17,827
[paul_tyler]: our own awards right on the retard
we should do our own retire tech award
635
00:28:17,907 –> 00:28:18,308
[paul_tyler]: program
636
00:28:18,828 –> 00:28:19,151
[laura_dinan_haber]: we should
637
00:28:19,160 –> 00:28:20,041
[paul_tyler]: this is just something that’s
638
00:28:20,718 –> 00:28:20,738
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
639
00:28:20,823 –> 00:28:22,646
[paul_tyler]: no common popping in my head at
this point so think
640
00:28:22,867 –> 00:28:22,888
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
641
00:28:23,006 –> 00:28:24,509
[paul_tyler]: i think we got to do better
642
00:28:24,748 –> 00:28:25,858
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
643
00:28:25,270 –> 00:28:29,497
[paul_tyler]: better jobs celebrating what we are doing
and i think be you know paul more
644
00:28:29,577 –> 00:28:29,978
[paul_tyler]: creative with
645
00:28:29,998 –> 00:28:30,341
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
646
00:28:30,018 –> 00:28:35,550
[paul_tyler]: technology re define what that quote physical
space is and when the celebration
647
00:28:35,338 –> 00:28:35,358
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
648
00:28:35,650 –> 00:28:38,637
[paul_tyler]: comes out so you
649
00:28:38,588 –> 00:28:38,829
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you know
650
00:28:39,990 –> 00:28:40,254
[paul_tyler]: oh
651
00:28:40,551 –> 00:28:41,272
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the phrase you
652
00:28:41,220 –> 00:28:41,461
[paul_tyler]: oh
653
00:28:41,352 –> 00:28:46,729
[paul_kalbfleisch]: attract what you celebrate which is from
the book and it’s actually a phrase i’ve
654
00:28:46,749 –> 00:28:51,569
[paul_kalbfleisch]: been using for for a number of
years and it came out of a lot
655
00:28:51,609 –> 00:28:58,140
[paul_kalbfleisch]: of research i was doing as to
what cities what cities that are really advancing
656
00:28:58,220 –> 00:29:03,030
[paul_kalbfleisch]: themselves in the innovation economy do you
know it’s kind of interesting people how do
657
00:29:03,091 –> 00:29:04,664
[paul_kalbfleisch]: we do how do we attract the
talent
658
00:29:04,440 –> 00:29:04,706
[paul_tyler]: yeah
659
00:29:07,068 –> 00:29:09,390
[paul_kalbfleisch]: as if there’s some sort of formula
of you
660
00:29:09,360 –> 00:29:09,380
[paul_tyler]: m
661
00:29:09,450 –> 00:29:14,436
[paul_kalbfleisch]: know well we pay them this much
you do that and and i said we’ll
662
00:29:14,516 –> 00:29:20,874
[paul_kalbfleisch]: celebrate what they do you you it
is true you you attract what you celebrate
663
00:29:20,894 –> 00:29:26,924
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you attract what you talk about you
attract what you put importance upon and most
664
00:29:27,025 –> 00:29:33,450
[paul_kalbfleisch]: importantly you attract what you celia in
fact so what you u u u openly
665
00:29:34,574 –> 00:29:35,155
[paul_kalbfleisch]: applaud
666
00:29:36,030 –> 00:29:36,171
[paul_tyler]: yah
667
00:29:36,159 –> 00:29:37,669
[paul_kalbfleisch]: now that’s
668
00:29:37,509 –> 00:29:37,530
[paul_tyler]: h
669
00:29:37,709 –> 00:29:44,492
[paul_kalbfleisch]: what you attract and so you just
take a look around well what exactly are
670
00:29:44,552 –> 00:29:50,041
[paul_kalbfleisch]: we celebrating through through that type of
definition and you may go oh my god
671
00:29:50,102 –> 00:29:51,945
[paul_kalbfleisch]: were no wonder we’re
672
00:29:51,810 –> 00:29:52,620
[paul_tyler]: yeah
673
00:29:52,005 –> 00:29:57,374
[paul_kalbfleisch]: not we’re actually attracted attracting the opposite
of what what because you do one way
674
00:29:57,414 –> 00:30:02,863
[paul_kalbfleisch]: or the order you are attracting something
you are a magnet to something and if
675
00:30:02,943 –> 00:30:08,412
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you choose to a lot of cities
sort of take a we have that two
676
00:30:08,933 –> 00:30:11,217
[paul_kalbfleisch]: kind of approach you know we’ve got
copy shops too
677
00:30:11,103 –> 00:30:11,244
[paul_tyler]: ah
678
00:30:11,297 –> 00:30:13,120
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and we’ve got bars
679
00:30:13,200 –> 00:30:13,564
[paul_tyler]: oh
680
00:30:13,200 –> 00:30:16,506
[paul_kalbfleisch]: with cool edison light bulbs and so
we got we got the same things the
681
00:30:16,546 –> 00:30:21,499
[paul_kalbfleisch]: other guys have so what you’re then
celebrating is sameness
682
00:30:21,399 –> 00:30:21,420
[paul_tyler]: m
683
00:30:21,619 –> 00:30:25,646
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and and mondaine and so you are
only going to
684
00:30:25,650 –> 00:30:25,938
[paul_tyler]: yeah
685
00:30:25,726 –> 00:30:31,355
[paul_kalbfleisch]: attract people who are sort of seeking
something safe and and and and the promise
686
00:30:31,535 –> 00:30:34,467
[paul_kalbfleisch]: of nothing rocking up um m
687
00:30:34,869 –> 00:30:34,890
[paul_tyler]: m
688
00:30:35,078 –> 00:30:40,779
[paul_kalbfleisch]: so it really does come down to
attracting what you celebrate and when it comes
689
00:30:40,859 –> 00:30:46,348
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to buildings and offices i heard someone
talk you know what’s what’s going to happen
690
00:30:47,290 –> 00:30:50,335
[paul_kalbfleisch]: now that we let the genie out
of the bottle in terms of work from
691
00:30:50,375 –> 00:30:52,338
[paul_kalbfleisch]: home and it really is jenny’s out
692
00:30:52,260 –> 00:30:52,442
[paul_tyler]: yeah
693
00:30:52,378 –> 00:30:56,846
[paul_kalbfleisch]: of the bottle now we know we
can do it um and and i think
694
00:30:56,906 –> 00:31:02,315
[paul_kalbfleisch]: one of the interesting things someone said
is head offices will become sort of artifacts
695
00:31:02,595 –> 00:31:06,571
[paul_kalbfleisch]: of company culture i thought that’s i’m
not quite sure what that really
696
00:31:06,480 –> 00:31:06,744
[paul_tyler]: oh
697
00:31:06,611 –> 00:31:08,675
[paul_kalbfleisch]: means but i think it’s a very
interesting direction
698
00:31:08,310 –> 00:31:08,910
[paul_tyler]: yeah
699
00:31:09,256 –> 00:31:13,182
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that when you walk into a head
office or you walk into the office it
700
00:31:13,403 –> 00:31:20,432
[paul_kalbfleisch]: should be a representation of your company
culture as opposed to just the place to
701
00:31:20,553 –> 00:31:22,836
[paul_kalbfleisch]: work because people can work from home
that can work everywhere
702
00:31:22,830 –> 00:31:24,360
[paul_tyler]: my
703
00:31:22,876 –> 00:31:23,777
[paul_kalbfleisch]: but when you come here
704
00:31:24,360 –> 00:31:24,380
[paul_tyler]: m
705
00:31:24,728 –> 00:31:26,694
[paul_kalbfleisch]: it’s it’s it’s the physical
706
00:31:26,409 –> 00:31:26,430
[paul_tyler]: m
707
00:31:26,774 –> 00:31:32,609
[paul_kalbfleisch]: manifestation of what the company’s culture is
and at that point that’s a whole new
708
00:31:32,689 –> 00:31:37,798
[paul_kalbfleisch]: meaning and a whole new purpose to
what an office is and it’s a very
709
00:31:37,898 –> 00:31:42,966
[paul_kalbfleisch]: valuable thing i think going forward because
i think you mentioned earlier you know are
710
00:31:43,006 –> 00:31:45,892
[paul_kalbfleisch]: we ever going to hang around a
coffee shop or the water cooler again and
711
00:31:45,932 –> 00:31:46,674
[paul_kalbfleisch]: exchange stories
712
00:31:46,950 –> 00:31:47,194
[paul_tyler]: oh
713
00:31:47,636 –> 00:31:50,921
[paul_kalbfleisch]: well that’s that stuff is gone
714
00:31:50,859 –> 00:31:50,880
[paul_tyler]: m
715
00:31:50,961 –> 00:31:56,130
[paul_kalbfleisch]: because you know the whole world is
different now so what is it that pulls
716
00:31:56,210 –> 00:32:01,168
[paul_kalbfleisch]: us together and gets us all rolling
in the same direction i think
717
00:32:01,170 –> 00:32:02,100
[paul_tyler]: yeah
718
00:32:01,229 –> 00:32:08,095
[paul_kalbfleisch]: it’s office space in public space that
acts as artifacts of the culture you want
719
00:32:08,115 –> 00:32:09,196
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to you want to you want to
720
00:32:09,520 –> 00:32:09,660
[paul_tyler]: well
721
00:32:09,597 –> 00:32:09,937
[paul_kalbfleisch]: promote
722
00:32:09,680 –> 00:32:14,330
[paul_tyler]: you know sometimes what’s old is new
so you know i worked at it i’ve
723
00:32:14,370 –> 00:32:16,976
[paul_tyler]: worked at a number of turns because
he spent life was one of the first
724
00:32:17,116 –> 00:32:17,437
[paul_tyler]: ones and
725
00:32:17,942 –> 00:32:18,023
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
726
00:32:18,078 –> 00:32:21,344
[paul_tyler]: you know we had a hall of
fame you know
727
00:32:21,438 –> 00:32:21,582
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
728
00:32:21,604 –> 00:32:22,586
[paul_tyler]: we had you old walk
729
00:32:22,499 –> 00:32:22,644
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
730
00:32:22,746 –> 00:32:27,574
[paul_tyler]: in jackie and here were the names
of the top agents s a big deal
731
00:32:27,935 –> 00:32:29,177
[paul_tyler]: to get to qualify you know
732
00:32:29,108 –> 00:32:29,270
[paul_kalbfleisch]: okay
733
00:32:29,217 –> 00:32:31,040
[paul_tyler]: you think about these what
734
00:32:31,059 –> 00:32:31,200
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
735
00:32:31,080 –> 00:32:34,646
[paul_tyler]: do you what you celebrate your check
you track paul
736
00:32:34,734 –> 00:32:34,876
[jackie_mandyck]: yes
737
00:32:34,766 –> 00:32:36,750
[paul_tyler]: ousurance business is tough like you know
you
738
00:32:36,703 –> 00:32:36,723
[jackie_mandyck]: m
739
00:32:36,810 –> 00:32:38,172
[paul_tyler]: talk about a rich job where you’re
740
00:32:38,164 –> 00:32:38,698
[paul_kalbfleisch]: hm
741
00:32:38,192 –> 00:32:40,015
[paul_tyler]: goin to get a fifty nos
742
00:32:39,928 –> 00:32:39,948
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
743
00:32:40,075 –> 00:32:43,160
[paul_tyler]: before you get a yes and so
a lot
744
00:32:43,138 –> 00:32:43,485
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
745
00:32:43,200 –> 00:32:49,591
[paul_tyler]: of these events the insurance companies historically
put together celebrate somebody persisting through that
746
00:32:50,818 –> 00:32:51,003
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
747
00:32:51,294 –> 00:32:56,663
[paul_tyler]: and having some remarkable cheap just about
sales about if s families protected you know
748
00:32:58,026 –> 00:33:01,713
[paul_tyler]: and you would have agents come in
and visit this thing they bring their family
749
00:33:01,773 –> 00:33:03,155
[paul_tyler]: in to see their name on a
wall
750
00:33:03,178 –> 00:33:03,320
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
751
00:33:03,296 –> 00:33:05,760
[paul_tyler]: you know jackie you know you know
752
00:33:07,645 –> 00:33:08,233
[jackie_mandyck]: hm
753
00:33:07,663 –> 00:33:09,346
[paul_tyler]: okay company goes public
754
00:33:08,592 –> 00:33:08,695
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
755
00:33:09,867 –> 00:33:14,875
[paul_tyler]: you know optimizes expansive you know the
hollow fame shrinks and shrinks and shrinks until
756
00:33:14,935 –> 00:33:19,603
[paul_tyler]: it’s pale probably it’s probably like it
box and some storage
757
00:33:20,098 –> 00:33:20,341
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
758
00:33:20,324 –> 00:33:21,827
[paul_tyler]: unit in new jersey right
759
00:33:21,748 –> 00:33:22,050
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
760
00:33:21,887 –> 00:33:23,570
[paul_tyler]: now unfortunately
761
00:33:23,500 –> 00:33:23,641
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
762
00:33:24,391 –> 00:33:24,752
[paul_tyler]: but yeah how
763
00:33:24,718 –> 00:33:25,978
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
764
00:33:24,772 –> 00:33:27,356
[paul_tyler]: do we do more of that i
don’t know jackie you know we’ve got some
765
00:33:27,416 –> 00:33:32,284
[paul_tyler]: great signs around hartford i love what
i’ve taken pictures i send people like paul
766
00:33:32,324 –> 00:33:32,905
[paul_tyler]: if you walked around
767
00:33:32,818 –> 00:33:32,838
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
768
00:33:32,945 –> 00:33:34,868
[paul_tyler]: hartford there’s a like old sign that
says
769
00:33:34,648 –> 00:33:34,970
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
770
00:33:35,409 –> 00:33:38,815
[paul_tyler]: this is the first jack you know
i’m sure you know this
771
00:33:38,744 –> 00:33:38,907
[jackie_mandyck]: wool
772
00:33:38,818 –> 00:33:40,348
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
773
00:33:38,855 –> 00:33:40,438
[paul_tyler]: one this is like the first
774
00:33:41,038 –> 00:33:41,321
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
775
00:33:41,159 –> 00:33:46,210
[paul_tyler]: car ride taken by a president or
something occurred here in art for
776
00:33:46,591 –> 00:33:47,278
[paul_kalbfleisch]: hm
777
00:33:47,914 –> 00:33:52,372
[paul_tyler]: here’s the first pay phone right and
you’ve you’ve kind of done
778
00:33:52,289 –> 00:33:52,450
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
779
00:33:52,412 –> 00:33:54,637
[paul_tyler]: that jack but you brought signage back
correct
780
00:33:55,673 –> 00:33:59,758
[jackie_mandyck]: yeah i think you know you’re bringing
about something else paul it’s it’s like
781
00:34:00,210 –> 00:34:00,930
[paul_tyler]: yeah
782
00:34:00,319 –> 00:34:05,196
[jackie_mandyck]: we can’t forget when we’re looking at
any of the work that we’re all doing
783
00:34:05,497 –> 00:34:08,782
[jackie_mandyck]: is it needs to be playful it
needs to be fun and we need to
784
00:34:08,822 –> 00:34:12,508
[jackie_mandyck]: take ourselves a little bit less seriously
so i think you and i have had
785
00:34:12,528 –> 00:34:17,506
[jackie_mandyck]: the conversation before you know i think
we should promoting that were the actuario capital
786
00:34:17,587 –> 00:34:22,371
[jackie_mandyck]: of the world you’re in hartford you
know and you know the numbers show it
787
00:34:22,512 –> 00:34:23,293
[jackie_mandyck]: you know or something
788
00:34:22,980 –> 00:34:23,202
[paul_tyler]: oh
789
00:34:23,374 –> 00:34:25,779
[jackie_mandyck]: like that and i mean be playful
with it you know
790
00:34:26,519 –> 00:34:27,907
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you could have a lot of fun
with
791
00:34:27,943 –> 00:34:28,023
[jackie_mandyck]: we
792
00:34:27,967 –> 00:34:28,108
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that
793
00:34:28,164 –> 00:34:28,424
[jackie_mandyck]: could
794
00:34:28,390 –> 00:34:28,510
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you
795
00:34:28,545 –> 00:34:28,625
[jackie_mandyck]: and
796
00:34:28,611 –> 00:34:28,832
[paul_kalbfleisch]: really
797
00:34:28,685 –> 00:34:28,986
[jackie_mandyck]: i think
798
00:34:28,913 –> 00:34:29,094
[paul_kalbfleisch]: could
799
00:34:29,066 –> 00:34:29,969
[jackie_mandyck]: that’s important
800
00:34:29,730 –> 00:34:30,013
[paul_tyler]: oh
801
00:34:31,363 –> 00:34:35,610
[jackie_mandyck]: everybody wants you know wants to be
in a place
802
00:34:35,608 –> 00:34:36,508
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
803
00:34:35,850 –> 00:34:40,157
[jackie_mandyck]: where people are having fun um and
i think our companies can do it it
804
00:34:40,217 –> 00:34:42,501
[jackie_mandyck]: brings about you know more creativity
805
00:34:41,998 –> 00:34:43,858
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
806
00:34:43,022 –> 00:34:47,029
[jackie_mandyck]: i bring about you know if you
look at all the studies you know innovation
807
00:34:47,089 –> 00:34:47,970
[jackie_mandyck]: and creativity
808
00:34:47,878 –> 00:34:48,688
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
809
00:34:48,211 –> 00:34:51,256
[jackie_mandyck]: can build out of crisis and it
can also build out of
810
00:34:52,408 –> 00:34:52,630
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
811
00:34:52,498 –> 00:34:58,248
[jackie_mandyck]: momentum and you know just playfulness and
that’s when we’re probably our most creative so
812
00:34:58,328 –> 00:35:02,635
[jackie_mandyck]: i think we’ve seen the crisis and
i think some people have survived the crisis
813
00:35:02,735 –> 00:35:08,876
[jackie_mandyck]: of covid because they have been able
to be very very creative i think hopefully
814
00:35:08,936 –> 00:35:14,987
[jackie_mandyck]: the next few years we can build
out of people having fun and really trying
815
00:35:15,148 –> 00:35:15,288
[jackie_mandyck]: to
816
00:35:15,150 –> 00:35:15,170
[paul_tyler]: m
817
00:35:16,330 –> 00:35:17,111
[jackie_mandyck]: go to the next
818
00:35:16,978 –> 00:35:18,388
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
819
00:35:18,293 –> 00:35:21,618
[jackie_mandyck]: the next level of what we want
to build for our communities and i think
820
00:35:21,838 –> 00:35:26,246
[jackie_mandyck]: you know paul says it really really
great in his book and i think just
821
00:35:26,286 –> 00:35:30,112
[jackie_mandyck]: to quote him and he says joy
is about being connected to the people and
822
00:35:30,413 –> 00:35:35,864
[jackie_mandyck]: s that fill your life with purpose
and make your world bigger i don’t know
823
00:35:35,965 –> 00:35:36,125
[jackie_mandyck]: how
824
00:35:36,088 –> 00:35:36,928
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
825
00:35:36,225 –> 00:35:39,691
[jackie_mandyck]: much more you can sum up what
you what we should be trying to build
826
00:35:39,771 –> 00:35:44,639
[jackie_mandyck]: in our cities than that and in
our companies our organizations it’s all
827
00:35:44,548 –> 00:35:44,568
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
828
00:35:44,679 –> 00:35:49,968
[jackie_mandyck]: about connectedness so however start to move
forward with work at home and remote work
829
00:35:50,129 –> 00:35:55,118
[jackie_mandyck]: i still think that there’s the the
conductivity that you need between individuals to be
830
00:35:55,198 –> 00:35:57,322
[jackie_mandyck]: creative to grow and to be innovative
831
00:35:58,649 –> 00:35:59,733
[laura_dinan_haber]: so jack go
832
00:35:59,671 –> 00:35:59,751
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you
833
00:35:59,754 –> 00:35:59,894
[laura_dinan_haber]: ahead
834
00:35:59,791 –> 00:35:59,892
[paul_kalbfleisch]: know
835
00:35:59,934 –> 00:36:00,095
[laura_dinan_haber]: paul
836
00:36:00,575 –> 00:36:01,661
[paul_kalbfleisch]: sorry go ahead go ahead laura
837
00:36:01,518 –> 00:36:01,778
[laura_dinan_haber]: it’s goin to
838
00:36:01,765 –> 00:36:01,785
[jackie_mandyck]: i
839
00:36:01,818 –> 00:36:02,219
[laura_dinan_haber]: say you
840
00:36:02,244 –> 00:36:02,324
[paul_kalbfleisch]: go
841
00:36:02,259 –> 00:36:02,339
[laura_dinan_haber]: know
842
00:36:02,364 –> 00:36:02,525
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ahead
843
00:36:02,439 –> 00:36:04,483
[laura_dinan_haber]: sitting here if if i am an
individual who
844
00:36:04,860 –> 00:36:04,880
[paul_tyler]: m
845
00:36:05,484 –> 00:36:08,630
[laura_dinan_haber]: is in a city regardless of the
city location how do
846
00:36:08,618 –> 00:36:09,133
[jackie_mandyck]: hm
847
00:36:08,730 –> 00:36:12,636
[laura_dinan_haber]: i how do i become more engaged
so we’re all you know remote for the
848
00:36:12,656 –> 00:36:15,121
[laura_dinan_haber]: most part i know there are people
who have gone back into the cities to
849
00:36:15,182 –> 00:36:18,950
[laura_dinan_haber]: work but if i’m listening to this
and i’m excited and i’m a creative and
850
00:36:19,010 –> 00:36:21,555
[laura_dinan_haber]: i want to become engaged and involved
how do
851
00:36:21,578 –> 00:36:22,093
[jackie_mandyck]: hm
852
00:36:21,595 –> 00:36:26,186
[laura_dinan_haber]: i do that how does the how
does someone become involved into this conversation
853
00:36:27,713 –> 00:36:30,197
[jackie_mandyck]: i think it’s just doing one thing
laura you know i’ve had a lot of
854
00:36:30,237 –> 00:36:33,523
[jackie_mandyck]: people asked me that like what should
we do how do you become involved and
855
00:36:33,583 –> 00:36:36,067
[jackie_mandyck]: i think it’s you know do one
thing that
856
00:36:35,932 –> 00:36:36,015
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ah
857
00:36:36,267 –> 00:36:40,616
[jackie_mandyck]: you wouldn’t do or makes you a
little bit uncomfortable or you know put yourself
858
00:36:40,736 –> 00:36:45,026
[jackie_mandyck]: out there a little bit it could
be write a bus in to work it
859
00:36:45,146 –> 00:36:50,855
[jackie_mandyck]: could be you know i don’t know
go to church it could be walk the
860
00:36:50,818 –> 00:36:51,988
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
861
00:36:50,915 –> 00:36:53,740
[jackie_mandyck]: city streets it could be just walking
around
862
00:36:53,638 –> 00:36:53,901
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
863
00:36:53,880 –> 00:36:57,430
[jackie_mandyck]: or bringing you know brought my kids
in there a little bit older now but
864
00:36:58,273 –> 00:37:02,744
[jackie_mandyck]: when they were little we just come
in and we would walk around it doesn’t
865
00:37:02,884 –> 00:37:07,232
[jackie_mandyck]: have to be like this big moment
or this big thing it can just be
866
00:37:07,773 –> 00:37:12,100
[jackie_mandyck]: one step and then you start to
build upon that it could be starting a
867
00:37:12,180 –> 00:37:17,248
[jackie_mandyck]: conversation with just one additional person at
the coffee shop that you visit it could
868
00:37:17,288 –> 00:37:20,113
[jackie_mandyck]: be in your community that you live
it could be in your community that you
869
00:37:20,193 –> 00:37:25,342
[jackie_mandyck]: work it’s just trying to open up
and trying to build upon that so i
870
00:37:25,422 –> 00:37:30,268
[jackie_mandyck]: think yeah that’s how you can start
small it doesn’t i think if people think
871
00:37:30,480 –> 00:37:30,763
[paul_tyler]: yeah
872
00:37:30,548 –> 00:37:34,495
[jackie_mandyck]: you have to do some big grandiose
type of thing that’s not what it is
873
00:37:34,615 –> 00:37:39,493
[jackie_mandyck]: it’s just starting to do one thing
just try one thing one thing different
874
00:37:41,650 –> 00:37:42,292
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you know cities
875
00:37:42,030 –> 00:37:42,131
[paul_tyler]: ye
876
00:37:42,353 –> 00:37:44,481
[paul_kalbfleisch]: are great places to observe i mean
877
00:37:44,732 –> 00:37:44,813
[paul_tyler]: ah
878
00:37:44,923 –> 00:37:47,098
[paul_kalbfleisch]: it’s and and
879
00:37:47,280 –> 00:37:47,300
[paul_tyler]: m
880
00:37:47,339 –> 00:37:52,728
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and observing sounds passive but you can
be very i think there is a form
881
00:37:52,808 –> 00:37:58,057
[paul_kalbfleisch]: of active observing and i just put
those two to get two words together so
882
00:37:58,097 –> 00:38:04,019
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i don’t reall know quite what that
means but you know these are just great
883
00:38:04,099 –> 00:38:09,969
[paul_kalbfleisch]: places to observe humanity and deserve observe
people and then to feel connected to that
884
00:38:10,069 –> 00:38:13,855
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and then that sort of pushes you
to the to the next step and that’s
885
00:38:13,895 –> 00:38:17,642
[paul_kalbfleisch]: why you know i mentioned earlier you
know great public space has its sort of
886
00:38:17,942 –> 00:38:21,648
[paul_kalbfleisch]: observation next to it so that you
know i’m not in the middle of the
887
00:38:21,688 –> 00:38:24,153
[paul_kalbfleisch]: square and i’m not jumping around on
stuff but i’m back here
888
00:38:24,390 –> 00:38:24,410
[paul_tyler]: m
889
00:38:24,453 –> 00:38:29,602
[paul_kalbfleisch]: but i’m feeling like i’m part of
the energy there’s a wonderful area in montreal
890
00:38:30,663 –> 00:38:32,787
[paul_kalbfleisch]: a lovely fountain area called near
891
00:38:33,129 –> 00:38:33,150
[paul_tyler]: m
892
00:38:33,228 –> 00:38:38,436
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the plaza arts theater and it is
a huge fountain area but there is no
893
00:38:38,516 –> 00:38:43,284
[paul_kalbfleisch]: barrier the fountain is part of the
sidewalk there there’s not even a two inch
894
00:38:43,365 –> 00:38:44,647
[paul_kalbfleisch]: or three inch curb to
895
00:38:44,580 –> 00:38:44,600
[paul_tyler]: m
896
00:38:44,707 –> 00:38:48,914
[paul_kalbfleisch]: step over you’re walking down the sidewalk
and all sudden there’s a son found and
897
00:38:49,034 –> 00:38:52,219
[paul_kalbfleisch]: kids run into it they run in
playing par it sort of stayed back and
898
00:38:52,239 –> 00:38:53,461
[paul_kalbfleisch]: there’s even a little grassy
899
00:38:53,250 –> 00:38:53,554
[paul_tyler]: oh
900
00:38:53,522 –> 00:38:56,867
[paul_kalbfleisch]: knoll for to sit on if you
want to sort of watch your kids but
901
00:38:56,927 –> 00:39:01,194
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i’ve sat there watching and i’ve noticed
how slowly and slowly the adults get closer
902
00:39:01,254 –> 00:39:04,059
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and closer and closer and the kids
come runnin and then out of the area
903
00:39:04,360 –> 00:39:09,007
[paul_kalbfleisch]: like because there’s no barrier they get
closer and then eventually the you know eventually
904
00:39:09,368 –> 00:39:13,595
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the adults are in the water too
and jumping around it doesn’t take take along
905
00:39:14,156 –> 00:39:16,303
[paul_kalbfleisch]: so observe the us ebbing i think
is really
906
00:39:16,470 –> 00:39:16,732
[paul_tyler]: yes
907
00:39:19,088 –> 00:39:23,675
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the first step and then to start
chasing what you’re observing kind of sounds weird
908
00:39:23,815 –> 00:39:26,794
[paul_kalbfleisch]: but m get involved with what
909
00:39:26,700 –> 00:39:28,050
[paul_tyler]: oh
910
00:39:26,814 –> 00:39:29,459
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you’re observing it’s
911
00:39:29,880 –> 00:39:30,930
[paul_tyler]: oh
912
00:39:30,381 –> 00:39:34,671
[paul_kalbfleisch]: if you have a creative inkling in
your mind you’ll you’ll do you’ll follow that
913
00:39:34,711 –> 00:39:36,616
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and you’ll be in the middle of
something before you know it
914
00:39:37,732 –> 00:39:42,640
[paul_tyler]: i do think small changes make big
differences like i love the outdoor
915
00:39:42,453 –> 00:39:42,998
[jackie_mandyck]: absolutely
916
00:39:42,700 –> 00:39:43,081
[paul_tyler]: dining
917
00:39:42,907 –> 00:39:42,928
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
918
00:39:43,481 –> 00:39:49,310
[paul_tyler]: i love the outdoor dining now what
if everybody who set those up instead of
919
00:39:49,731 –> 00:39:54,815
[paul_tyler]: putting all the chairs train towards each
other put them out towards the street like
920
00:39:54,875 –> 00:39:55,336
[paul_tyler]: i just spent
921
00:39:55,564 –> 00:39:56,338
[paul_kalbfleisch]: hm
922
00:39:56,076 –> 00:40:00,951
[paul_tyler]: i spent a couple of days in
paris last week i love it they unabashably
923
00:40:01,011 –> 00:40:04,597
[paul_tyler]: turn the chairs out you know the
street is the entertainment
924
00:40:05,848 –> 00:40:05,969
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
925
00:40:06,100 –> 00:40:07,362
[paul_tyler]: it is about observation
926
00:40:06,938 –> 00:40:07,079
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
927
00:40:07,442 –> 00:40:11,469
[paul_tyler]: is about a community and it’s there
is no barrier right other than a little
928
00:40:11,669 –> 00:40:16,337
[paul_tyler]: tap i love that and it’s it’s
just changes the dynamics
929
00:40:16,018 –> 00:40:16,978
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
930
00:40:16,377 –> 00:40:21,626
[paul_tyler]: and the interaction so quickly you know
wait turn chairs outward really
931
00:40:23,478 –> 00:40:27,502
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah yeah it’s and and then also
932
00:40:27,563 –> 00:40:27,684
[paul_tyler]: ah
933
00:40:27,823 –> 00:40:33,272
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i saw in some city where instead
of having park benches sort of park bench
934
00:40:33,372 –> 00:40:37,659
[paul_kalbfleisch]: park bench in a row all facing
in one direction they purpose bolted them in
935
00:40:37,799 –> 00:40:43,426
[paul_kalbfleisch]: so that if you sat down you
were facing a stranger and i thought i
936
00:40:43,506 –> 00:40:43,907
[paul_kalbfleisch]: walked by my
937
00:40:44,460 –> 00:40:45,060
[paul_tyler]: yeah
938
00:40:44,748 –> 00:40:45,529
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that’s pretty cool
939
00:40:46,380 –> 00:40:46,400
[paul_tyler]: m
940
00:40:46,410 –> 00:40:48,714
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and they even sort of like bolted
in a coffee table
941
00:40:48,420 –> 00:40:51,930
[paul_tyler]: oh
942
00:40:48,894 –> 00:40:52,781
[paul_kalbfleisch]: so that you know it became a
place to set your coffee down and and
943
00:40:53,943 –> 00:40:54,043
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you
944
00:40:54,013 –> 00:40:55,153
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
945
00:40:54,063 –> 00:40:57,469
[paul_kalbfleisch]: know if you don’t want to talk
to somebody you don’t have but if you’re
946
00:40:57,583 –> 00:40:58,273
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
947
00:40:58,551 –> 00:40:59,493
[paul_kalbfleisch]: a little bit interested
948
00:40:59,259 –> 00:40:59,280
[paul_tyler]: m
949
00:41:00,535 –> 00:41:03,781
[paul_kalbfleisch]: next thing you know you are engaged
the next thing you know you are sharing
950
00:41:03,841 –> 00:41:08,559
[paul_kalbfleisch]: stories the next thing you know you
are part of something and and that’s really
951
00:41:08,619 –> 00:41:11,365
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the model of kind of what we’re
talking about to get you to the point
952
00:41:11,385 –> 00:41:12,527
[paul_kalbfleisch]: where you feel part of something
953
00:41:15,628 –> 00:41:20,828
[laura_dinan_haber]: it’s almost like i’m hearing as much
as you’re building out physical space it’s really
954
00:41:20,909 –> 00:41:25,258
[laura_dinan_haber]: more about building that connection to humans
and it’s fascinating
955
00:41:25,254 –> 00:41:25,888
[paul_kalbfleisch]: hm
956
00:41:25,338 –> 00:41:25,598
[laura_dinan_haber]: because
957
00:41:25,680 –> 00:41:26,460
[paul_tyler]: oh
958
00:41:25,698 –> 00:41:27,642
[laura_dinan_haber]: i’m curious you know two years
959
00:41:27,690 –> 00:41:28,380
[paul_tyler]: yeah
960
00:41:27,783 –> 00:41:32,190
[laura_dinan_haber]: five years down the line where we’re
going to be with physical space and if
961
00:41:32,210 –> 00:41:33,171
[laura_dinan_haber]: we’re gonna be utilizing
962
00:41:32,878 –> 00:41:33,421
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
963
00:41:33,211 –> 00:41:35,393
[laura_dinan_haber]: it in the same way and then
964
00:41:35,398 –> 00:41:35,661
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
965
00:41:35,553 –> 00:41:35,813
[laura_dinan_haber]: adding
966
00:41:35,610 –> 00:41:35,912
[paul_tyler]: yeah
967
00:41:35,993 –> 00:41:41,309
[laura_dinan_haber]: you know a virtual element to that
or are we going to be dreaming completely
968
00:41:41,369 –> 00:41:44,455
[laura_dinan_haber]: differently i have no idea because i
could see it going a million a million
969
00:41:44,495 –> 00:41:49,223
[laura_dinan_haber]: ways in my mind but i think
the heart of connection and then finding that
970
00:41:49,363 –> 00:41:51,546
[laura_dinan_haber]: joy is really important here
971
00:41:51,598 –> 00:41:52,678
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
972
00:41:51,947 –> 00:41:59,309
[laura_dinan_haber]: and i ges the analytic part of
my brain is curious is there importance measuring
973
00:41:59,369 –> 00:42:02,915
[laura_dinan_haber]: that joy so do we use joy
as a feeling to say this is right
974
00:42:03,035 –> 00:42:07,884
[laura_dinan_haber]: i know this is good or are
we at some point going to say joy
975
00:42:07,964 –> 00:42:09,687
[laura_dinan_haber]: is happening we know this is good
this
976
00:42:09,570 –> 00:42:10,770
[paul_tyler]: oh
977
00:42:09,727 –> 00:42:12,391
[laura_dinan_haber]: is what we wan and are we
going to seek to measure joy
978
00:42:12,277 –> 00:42:12,298
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
979
00:42:12,712 –> 00:42:12,952
[laura_dinan_haber]: and then
980
00:42:13,140 –> 00:42:14,250
[paul_tyler]: oh
981
00:42:13,493 –> 00:42:16,959
[laura_dinan_haber]: look to build upon that to build
our next installment or activation
982
00:42:16,558 –> 00:42:16,639
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ye
983
00:42:17,019 –> 00:42:20,845
[laura_dinan_haber]: or creation or do we leave joy
as a sense of this was the goal
984
00:42:20,885 –> 00:42:21,787
[laura_dinan_haber]: and that’s where it’s going to be
985
00:42:26,142 –> 00:42:30,082
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i think we’re humans and so we’ll
want to measure it
986
00:42:30,343 –> 00:42:31,483
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
987
00:42:31,538 –> 00:42:32,620
[laura_dinan_haber]: yeah
988
00:42:31,689 –> 00:42:33,953
[paul_kalbfleisch]: now we may not be able to
we may not be able
989
00:42:33,862 –> 00:42:34,063
[laura_dinan_haber]: right
990
00:42:34,013 –> 00:42:35,476
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to do anything with the measurement
991
00:42:35,065 –> 00:42:35,486
[laura_dinan_haber]: right right
992
00:42:36,198 –> 00:42:39,204
[paul_kalbfleisch]: but we’ll feel good about having measured
something
993
00:42:45,300 –> 00:42:46,080
[paul_tyler]: yeah
994
00:42:45,631 –> 00:42:46,593
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and you know i’d be curious
995
00:42:46,290 –> 00:42:46,310
[paul_tyler]: m
996
00:42:46,853 –> 00:42:47,194
[paul_kalbfleisch]: like so
997
00:42:47,880 –> 00:42:48,165
[paul_tyler]: yeah
998
00:42:48,696 –> 00:42:51,741
[paul_kalbfleisch]: can we understand when people are
999
00:42:51,780 –> 00:42:52,024
[paul_tyler]: oh
1000
00:42:51,821 –> 00:42:58,653
[paul_kalbfleisch]: feeling this way and they spend more
time with somebody is opposed to an isolation
1001
00:42:59,314 –> 00:43:04,142
[paul_kalbfleisch]: what changes and you know you have
one sort of test test group versus another
1002
00:43:04,222 –> 00:43:09,293
[paul_kalbfleisch]: test group there’s probably lots hat we
can learn from that and then there’s lots
1003
00:43:09,393 –> 00:43:12,624
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that we can then use to help
program things in the future
1004
00:43:12,300 –> 00:43:12,484
[paul_tyler]: ye
1005
00:43:14,748 –> 00:43:16,791
[paul_kalbfleisch]: but we also have to keep in
mind that you know
1006
00:43:16,740 –> 00:43:17,003
[paul_tyler]: oh
1007
00:43:16,851 –> 00:43:21,538
[paul_kalbfleisch]: one of the key aspects of joy
is how it sneaks up on you and
1008
00:43:21,619 –> 00:43:23,442
[paul_kalbfleisch]: if we overly program joy
1009
00:43:23,400 –> 00:43:24,386
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1010
00:43:23,542 –> 00:43:24,403
[paul_kalbfleisch]: then it stops being
1011
00:43:24,319 –> 00:43:24,501
[laura_dinan_haber]: right
1012
00:43:24,463 –> 00:43:27,368
[paul_kalbfleisch]: joined so you use our researches as
1013
00:43:27,300 –> 00:43:27,586
[paul_tyler]: ye
1014
00:43:27,448 –> 00:43:30,654
[paul_kalbfleisch]: a bit of a guide but then
throw it over to some artist who is
1015
00:43:30,690 –> 00:43:30,951
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1016
00:43:30,694 –> 00:43:33,479
[paul_kalbfleisch]: going to do something really weird that
no one thought of you know
1017
00:43:33,750 –> 00:43:34,134
[paul_tyler]: oh
1018
00:43:34,621 –> 00:43:35,924
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and then we’re back on
1019
00:43:35,890 –> 00:43:36,050
[paul_tyler]: well
1020
00:43:36,024 –> 00:43:36,225
[paul_kalbfleisch]: track
1021
00:43:36,791 –> 00:43:41,098
[paul_tyler]: paul we live in such quantitative environment
every
1022
00:43:41,508 –> 00:43:42,238
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1023
00:43:41,639 –> 00:43:46,467
[paul_tyler]: right jackie be interest would be interesting
to like forget about net promoter scores we
1024
00:43:46,547 –> 00:43:50,683
[paul_tyler]: heard so much about it like what’s
hartford’s joy score
1025
00:43:52,113 –> 00:43:52,253
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
1026
00:43:52,406 –> 00:43:52,586
[paul_tyler]: it is
1027
00:43:54,359 –> 00:43:54,981
[jackie_mandyck]: i think it depends
1028
00:43:54,780 –> 00:43:55,110
[paul_tyler]: oh
1029
00:43:55,021 –> 00:43:55,221
[jackie_mandyck]: upon
1030
00:43:55,193 –> 00:43:55,275
[paul_kalbfleisch]: it
1031
00:43:55,342 –> 00:43:56,846
[jackie_mandyck]: who you who you asked
1032
00:43:57,238 –> 00:43:57,600
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1033
00:43:58,190 –> 00:44:01,834
[jackie_mandyck]: you know some i don’t know if
you can
1034
00:44:01,980 –> 00:44:02,062
[paul_kalbfleisch]: ye
1035
00:44:02,275 –> 00:44:03,738
[jackie_mandyck]: program for joy
1036
00:44:04,350 –> 00:44:05,580
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1037
00:44:04,600 –> 00:44:13,175
[jackie_mandyck]: sometimes i think happiness or you know
joy is brought about by seeking something or
1038
00:44:14,056 –> 00:44:17,740
[jackie_mandyck]: you know doing something or just experiencing
something
1039
00:44:17,400 –> 00:44:17,743
[paul_tyler]: oh
1040
00:44:17,860 –> 00:44:22,607
[jackie_mandyck]: it doesn’t have to be something that
you know oh i go here and i’m
1041
00:44:22,667 –> 00:44:26,967
[jackie_mandyck]: going to feel happiness or i’m going
to feel joy it’s it might be
1042
00:44:26,998 –> 00:44:27,406
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1043
00:44:27,048 –> 00:44:33,000
[jackie_mandyck]: about the experience of getting there rather
than when you get there so i don’t
1044
00:44:33,440 –> 00:44:35,704
[jackie_mandyck]: i don’t know how to answer that
paul basically
1045
00:44:35,970 –> 00:44:36,952
[paul_tyler]: uh
1046
00:44:36,606 –> 00:44:38,208
[jackie_mandyck]: i think you know i think
1047
00:44:38,568 –> 00:44:38,629
[paul_kalbfleisch]: she
1048
00:44:38,609 –> 00:44:40,272
[jackie_mandyck]: you know what makes you happy
1049
00:44:40,059 –> 00:44:40,080
[paul_tyler]: h
1050
00:44:40,412 –> 00:44:41,573
[jackie_mandyck]: might make me cringe
1051
00:44:41,910 –> 00:44:43,290
[paul_tyler]: oh
1052
00:44:42,038 –> 00:44:42,058
[laura_dinan_haber]: m
1053
00:44:42,174 –> 00:44:44,196
[jackie_mandyck]: i think to paul’s
1054
00:44:44,578 –> 00:44:45,478
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1055
00:44:45,077 –> 00:44:46,318
[jackie_mandyck]: you know statements earlier
1056
00:44:46,218 –> 00:44:49,108
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1057
00:44:46,859 –> 00:44:49,461
[jackie_mandyck]: it needs to be flexible space it
needs to be
1058
00:44:50,377 –> 00:44:50,398
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i
1059
00:44:51,913 –> 00:44:52,634
[jackie_mandyck]: different people
1060
00:44:52,468 –> 00:44:52,690
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1061
00:44:52,735 –> 00:44:55,361
[jackie_mandyck]: can get different things out of maybe
the same thing
1062
00:44:56,098 –> 00:44:56,421
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1063
00:44:56,674 –> 00:45:00,495
[jackie_mandyck]: with that experience so the willingness
1064
00:45:00,320 –> 00:45:00,967
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah i think
1065
00:45:01,236 –> 00:45:05,603
[jackie_mandyck]: you know i think that’s very important
you know being being you know i also
1066
00:45:05,723 –> 00:45:11,656
[jackie_mandyck]: think being creative and being innovative you
have to have a high tolerance for risk
1067
00:45:11,338 –> 00:45:11,541
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1068
00:45:12,543 –> 00:45:16,033
[jackie_mandyck]: because you need to make it okay
for people to fail
1069
00:45:16,870 –> 00:45:17,014
[paul_kalbfleisch]: right
1070
00:45:17,215 –> 00:45:21,723
[jackie_mandyck]: for them to try and be more
creative and more innovative so it’s building that
1071
00:45:21,823 –> 00:45:25,529
[jackie_mandyck]: kind of culture around things as well
you know we can talk about joy we
1072
00:45:25,589 –> 00:45:29,756
[jackie_mandyck]: can talk about creativity we can talk
about innovation and but it’s trying to build
1073
00:45:29,836 –> 00:45:32,380
[jackie_mandyck]: that supportive network that allows
1074
00:45:32,480 –> 00:45:32,705
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1075
00:45:32,500 –> 00:45:33,342
[jackie_mandyck]: people to do that
1076
00:45:35,533 –> 00:45:40,631
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you know that you use the word
experimentation there in our books called the joy
1077
00:45:40,711 –> 00:45:45,755
[paul_kalbfleisch]: experiments and the word experiment i think
is just as important as the word joy
1078
00:45:47,176 –> 00:45:52,604
[paul_kalbfleisch]: in terms of in order to do
all the things we’re talking about in order
1079
00:45:52,684 –> 00:45:59,175
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to be an innovation center in order
to be a company that that fosters innovation
1080
00:45:59,375 –> 00:46:04,506
[paul_kalbfleisch]: or a community that fosters innovate and
you have to be able to also accept
1081
00:46:05,398 –> 00:46:08,583
[paul_kalbfleisch]: um experimentation and failure
1082
00:46:08,623 –> 00:46:08,643
[jackie_mandyck]: m
1083
00:46:09,545 –> 00:46:15,655
[paul_kalbfleisch]: as part of that that failure is
not really failure is not you give up
1084
00:46:15,775 –> 00:46:19,241
[paul_kalbfleisch]: failure is okay i learned how not
do it so now i’m one step closer
1085
00:46:19,301 –> 00:46:23,748
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to learning how how to do it
sort of thing and as much as it’s
1086
00:46:23,788 –> 00:46:30,280
[paul_kalbfleisch]: great to have the walls of fame
for those who succeed you know it it’s
1087
00:46:30,601 –> 00:46:40,781
[paul_kalbfleisch]: always it’s also good to find ways
of letting people sort of in a weird
1088
00:46:40,861 –> 00:46:47,856
[paul_kalbfleisch]: way celebrate celebrate the struggle or celebrate
the process may maybe that’s the best phrase
1089
00:46:48,397 –> 00:46:55,709
[paul_kalbfleisch]: celebrating the process which is you know
a lot of stops and start and twisting
1090
00:46:55,849 –> 00:46:59,976
[paul_kalbfleisch]: around and you know you can do
that by creating a maze you you can
1091
00:47:00,136 –> 00:47:01,619
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you can you can you can create
a public
1092
00:47:01,560 –> 00:47:01,808
[paul_tyler]: yes
1093
00:47:01,799 –> 00:47:06,166
[paul_kalbfleisch]: maze and in a public square that’s
really a metaphor
1094
00:47:06,155 –> 00:47:06,422
[paul_tyler]: thank you
1095
00:47:07,188 –> 00:47:07,491
[paul_kalbfleisch]: four
1096
00:47:09,099 –> 00:47:09,120
[paul_tyler]: m
1097
00:47:09,970 –> 00:47:14,780
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the process of innovation and and and
have fun and some lapse in it and
1098
00:47:15,661 –> 00:47:19,400
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and come out the other end feeling
like it’s okay we
1099
00:47:19,440 –> 00:47:19,460
[paul_tyler]: m
1100
00:47:19,660 –> 00:47:22,268
[paul_kalbfleisch]: we all we all kind of get
it wrong at first but eventually we get
1101
00:47:22,328 –> 00:47:29,455
[paul_kalbfleisch]: it right and that’s part of the
process and so so let’s all stick together
1102
00:47:29,515 –> 00:47:30,237
[paul_kalbfleisch]: as we go through that
1103
00:47:31,471 –> 00:47:34,062
[paul_tyler]: excellent laura oh
1104
00:47:34,960 –> 00:47:37,826
[laura_dinan_haber]: my favorite question i say to the
end and sometimes i wish i just
1105
00:47:37,768 –> 00:47:37,788
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
1106
00:47:37,866 –> 00:47:40,512
[laura_dinan_haber]: start with it jackie what is your
why why do
1107
00:47:40,537 –> 00:47:40,558
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
1108
00:47:40,572 –> 00:47:40,632
[laura_dinan_haber]: you
1109
00:47:40,590 –> 00:47:40,852
[paul_tyler]: oh
1110
00:47:40,692 –> 00:47:42,396
[laura_dinan_haber]: wake up every morning and do the
work that you do
1111
00:47:42,970 –> 00:47:43,072
[paul_kalbfleisch]: no
1112
00:47:45,363 –> 00:47:47,649
[jackie_mandyck]: my goodness laura you guys really i
mean
1113
00:47:47,519 –> 00:47:47,800
[paul_kalbfleisch]: jes
1114
00:47:47,729 –> 00:47:49,735
[jackie_mandyck]: i feel like i should be getting
a college credit
1115
00:47:49,590 –> 00:47:49,851
[paul_tyler]: oh
1116
00:47:49,795 –> 00:47:50,697
[jackie_mandyck]: for this or something like
1117
00:47:50,596 –> 00:47:50,616
[paul_tyler]: h
1118
00:47:50,738 –> 00:47:51,179
[jackie_mandyck]: that to a
1119
00:47:51,382 –> 00:47:53,008
[laura_dinan_haber]: we can we can create an award
1120
00:47:52,809 –> 00:47:52,830
[paul_tyler]: h
1121
00:47:53,068 –> 00:47:53,670
[laura_dinan_haber]: for you jackie
1122
00:47:54,113 –> 00:47:56,819
[jackie_mandyck]: thank you i appreciate that you know
why do
1123
00:47:56,818 –> 00:47:57,478
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1124
00:47:56,879 –> 00:47:57,661
[jackie_mandyck]: i get up every morning
1125
00:47:58,708 –> 00:47:58,954
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1126
00:48:00,493 –> 00:48:04,160
[jackie_mandyck]: i really think the work that my
organization
1127
00:48:04,048 –> 00:48:04,251
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yes
1128
00:48:04,360 –> 00:48:04,741
[jackie_mandyck]: does
1129
00:48:04,708 –> 00:48:06,949
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh oh
1130
00:48:07,145 –> 00:48:07,749
[jackie_mandyck]: makes a difference
1131
00:48:08,818 –> 00:48:09,099
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1132
00:48:09,914 –> 00:48:15,618
[jackie_mandyck]: and i think that’s very important for
my personal satisfaction
1133
00:48:15,450 –> 00:48:15,470
[paul_tyler]: m
1134
00:48:16,038 –> 00:48:20,425
[jackie_mandyck]: for definitely my board thinking that that’s
now
1135
00:48:20,578 –> 00:48:20,842
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1136
00:48:20,607 –> 00:48:24,606
[jackie_mandyck]: what we do but you know it
truly is you know some days i don’t
1137
00:48:24,686 –> 00:48:28,410
[jackie_mandyck]: wake up feeling like i’ve made a
difference you know some days are a struggle
1138
00:48:29,071 –> 00:48:35,448
[jackie_mandyck]: but as i heard somebody say just
the other day that if thirty three percent
1139
00:48:35,488 –> 00:48:40,769
[jackie_mandyck]: of the time i’m feeling really great
about what i’m doing and thirty three percent
1140
00:48:40,829 –> 00:48:43,974
[jackie_mandyck]: of the time i’m feeling good and
then thirty three percent of the time it’s
1141
00:48:43,994 –> 00:48:48,642
[jackie_mandyck]: a little bit of a struggle then
that’s an okay i’ll take those percentages i
1142
00:48:48,702 –> 00:48:51,867
[jackie_mandyck]: want to make it difference and i
want our organization to make a difference and
1143
00:48:51,927 –> 00:48:56,944
[jackie_mandyck]: i think we do and i think
that’s that’s why i do the work that
1144
00:48:57,044 –> 00:49:03,441
[jackie_mandyck]: i do and honestly i find joy
in what i do i find joy in
1145
00:49:03,541 –> 00:49:06,927
[jackie_mandyck]: connecting i think that’s one of the
things we haven’t touched upon during the podcast
1146
00:49:07,007 –> 00:49:07,267
[jackie_mandyck]: today
1147
00:49:07,020 –> 00:49:07,204
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1148
00:49:07,428 –> 00:49:10,894
[jackie_mandyck]: is you know a lot of the
work that i do is i connect people
1149
00:49:11,174 –> 00:49:16,745
[jackie_mandyck]: a lot in organizations and thoughts and
process and projects and how can we make
1150
00:49:16,826 –> 00:49:20,473
[jackie_mandyck]: something um how can we take
1151
00:49:20,497 –> 00:49:20,518
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
1152
00:49:20,513 –> 00:49:24,359
[jackie_mandyck]: two and two and get way more
than four so my
1153
00:49:24,328 –> 00:49:25,978
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1154
00:49:24,459 –> 00:49:27,144
[jackie_mandyck]: thing is about it’s kind of putting
those puzzle pieces together
1155
00:49:26,850 –> 00:49:27,093
[paul_tyler]: oh
1156
00:49:27,304 –> 00:49:29,828
[jackie_mandyck]: that brings me joy um and
1157
00:49:29,739 –> 00:49:29,760
[paul_tyler]: m
1158
00:49:29,949 –> 00:49:35,940
[jackie_mandyck]: i’m very very fortunate because my organization
my board and i found a job that
1159
00:49:35,980 –> 00:49:36,360
[jackie_mandyck]: allows
1160
00:49:36,480 –> 00:49:37,140
[paul_tyler]: oh
1161
00:49:36,481 –> 00:49:40,067
[jackie_mandyck]: me to do that and be fulfilled
doing that kind of work so i think
1162
00:49:40,188 –> 00:49:43,165
[jackie_mandyck]: that’s that’s that’s
1163
00:49:43,198 –> 00:49:43,402
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yes
1164
00:49:43,226 –> 00:49:45,241
[jackie_mandyck]: my why that’s my way
1165
00:49:45,688 –> 00:49:46,408
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1166
00:49:46,568 –> 00:49:47,493
[laura_dinan_haber]: and paul what is your why
1167
00:49:49,339 –> 00:49:49,842
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh darrin
1168
00:49:49,748 –> 00:49:50,012
[laura_dinan_haber]: yeah
1169
00:49:49,902 –> 00:49:50,164
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i thought
1170
00:49:50,070 –> 00:49:51,630
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1171
00:49:50,184 –> 00:49:51,712
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you were going to give me a
different
1172
00:49:51,680 –> 00:49:51,922
[laura_dinan_haber]: never
1173
00:49:51,832 –> 00:49:52,295
[paul_kalbfleisch]: question
1174
00:49:52,200 –> 00:49:52,561
[paul_tyler]: oh
1175
00:49:54,341 –> 00:49:55,905
[paul_kalbfleisch]: okay uh
1176
00:49:56,100 –> 00:49:56,383
[paul_tyler]: oh
1177
00:49:56,908 –> 00:49:58,512
[paul_kalbfleisch]: well i guess i think i have
two wise
1178
00:49:58,320 –> 00:49:58,625
[paul_tyler]: oh
1179
00:49:59,034 –> 00:49:59,756
[paul_kalbfleisch]: one is
1180
00:50:01,050 –> 00:50:01,272
[paul_tyler]: oh
1181
00:50:01,678 –> 00:50:06,646
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i’m a very very lucky guy to
be able to be involved in the stuff
1182
00:50:06,806 –> 00:50:06,946
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that
1183
00:50:07,020 –> 00:50:07,308
[paul_tyler]: oh
1184
00:50:07,047 –> 00:50:08,649
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i’m doing um
1185
00:50:09,360 –> 00:50:09,641
[paul_tyler]: oh
1186
00:50:09,931 –> 00:50:14,079
[paul_kalbfleisch]: richard florida saw richard florida give a
talk and then he started off saying i’m
1187
00:50:14,300 –> 00:50:14,380
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i’m
1188
00:50:15,112 –> 00:50:15,133
[jackie_mandyck]: m
1189
00:50:15,243 –> 00:50:19,295
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i’m a very fortunate individual i have
1190
00:50:20,100 –> 00:50:20,120
[paul_tyler]: m
1191
00:50:20,488 –> 00:50:25,196
[paul_kalbfleisch]: no business being involved in this you
know i’m a very very lucky person he
1192
00:50:25,256 –> 00:50:28,361
[paul_kalbfleisch]: said and lucky people have this way
of landing in the middle of stuff
1193
00:50:28,230 –> 00:50:28,430
[paul_tyler]: yah
1194
00:50:28,381 –> 00:50:30,344
[paul_kalbfleisch]: they have no business being in the
middle of
1195
00:50:30,339 –> 00:50:30,360
[paul_tyler]: h
1196
00:50:31,005 –> 00:50:34,291
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and the fact that they shouldn’t be
there is why they can add value
1197
00:50:34,179 –> 00:50:34,200
[paul_tyler]: m
1198
00:50:34,912 –> 00:50:35,393
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and and
1199
00:50:35,340 –> 00:50:35,581
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1200
00:50:36,615 –> 00:50:36,755
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that’s
1201
00:50:36,648 –> 00:50:36,810
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1202
00:50:36,935 –> 00:50:38,378
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that okay i’m gonna i’m gonna steal
1203
00:50:38,232 –> 00:50:38,252
[paul_tyler]: i
1204
00:50:38,438 –> 00:50:41,643
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that and start using it to describe
my situation i mean i’m not an architect
1205
00:50:41,723 –> 00:50:42,825
[paul_kalbfleisch]: i’m not an urban planner
1206
00:50:44,143 –> 00:50:44,863
[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
1207
00:50:44,308 –> 00:50:46,199
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m but i am a person
1208
00:50:46,080 –> 00:50:46,342
[paul_tyler]: oh
1209
00:50:46,320 –> 00:50:46,460
[paul_kalbfleisch]: who
1210
00:50:47,250 –> 00:50:47,513
[paul_tyler]: oh
1211
00:50:47,281 –> 00:50:51,608
[paul_kalbfleisch]: through my years in the field of
marketing studied society
1212
00:50:51,510 –> 00:50:51,753
[paul_tyler]: oh
1213
00:50:51,709 –> 00:50:52,891
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and studied culture
1214
00:50:52,860 –> 00:50:53,550
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1215
00:50:52,971 –> 00:50:58,020
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and studied how what goes on with
people and that then allowed me to sort
1216
00:50:57,900 –> 00:50:58,145
[paul_tyler]: oh
1217
00:50:58,080 –> 00:51:02,770
[paul_kalbfleisch]: of move into to this space you
know and i’m involved in all kinds of
1218
00:51:03,110 –> 00:51:10,129
[paul_kalbfleisch]: great and fantastic projects so so my
why is i get great joy out of
1219
00:51:10,189 –> 00:51:17,161
[paul_kalbfleisch]: doing what i do the second one
is i believe this area
1220
00:51:17,130 –> 00:51:17,730
[paul_tyler]: oh
1221
00:51:17,181 –> 00:51:22,537
[paul_kalbfleisch]: that we’re talking about public space and
bringing people connection congregation and all of these
1222
00:51:22,597 –> 00:51:31,137
[paul_kalbfleisch]: things is incredibly important right now society
is divided and you can talk about any
1223
00:51:31,238 –> 00:51:35,164
[paul_kalbfleisch]: topic on anything and we’re divided and
there’s a million
1224
00:51:35,471 –> 00:51:35,635
[laura_dinan_haber]: yeah
1225
00:51:35,485 –> 00:51:35,945
[paul_kalbfleisch]: reasons
1226
00:51:35,520 –> 00:51:35,742
[paul_tyler]: oh
1227
00:51:36,106 –> 00:51:39,567
[paul_kalbfleisch]: why uh to the point where you
can
1228
00:51:39,578 –> 00:51:40,238
[laura_dinan_haber]: yeah
1229
00:51:39,668 –> 00:51:39,809
[paul_kalbfleisch]: say
1230
00:51:40,093 –> 00:51:40,435
[jackie_mandyck]: yeah
1231
00:51:41,388 –> 00:51:44,673
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the week is broken and we have
to rebuild the weight
1232
00:51:44,683 –> 00:51:45,343
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
1233
00:51:44,813 –> 00:51:45,715
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the week and where is that
1234
00:51:45,643 –> 00:51:45,867
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
1235
00:51:45,735 –> 00:51:49,862
[paul_kalbfleisch]: going to happen it’s not going to
come from national political parties it’s not going
1236
00:51:49,902 –> 00:51:53,851
[paul_kalbfleisch]: to come from you know big organizations
as we’re not going to fix it in
1237
00:51:53,952 –> 00:51:59,373
[paul_kalbfleisch]: dobbo switzerland we’re going to fix it
in cities and we’re going to fix it
1238
00:52:00,748 –> 00:52:03,778
[paul_kalbfleisch]: in cities by creating public spaces where
1239
00:52:03,720 –> 00:52:03,963
[paul_tyler]: yeah
1240
00:52:03,878 –> 00:52:06,306
[paul_kalbfleisch]: two people who don’t belong to the
same algorithm
1241
00:52:05,940 –> 00:52:05,960
[paul_tyler]: m
1242
00:52:07,338 –> 00:52:09,363
[paul_kalbfleisch]: bump into each other start doing something
1243
00:52:09,240 –> 00:52:10,012
[paul_tyler]: my
1244
00:52:09,424 –> 00:52:17,821
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and laugh and giggle and find that
hey we’re not so different and that may
1245
00:52:17,902 –> 00:52:22,249
[paul_kalbfleisch]: sound sort of silly and glib to
say that you know playing in public is
1246
00:52:22,309 –> 00:52:28,890
[paul_kalbfleisch]: gonna is where we start to fix
society but you know playing between human beings
1247
00:52:28,970 –> 00:52:34,580
[paul_kalbfleisch]: is a very very very complex psychological
thing it’s realy there’s books about how complex
1248
00:52:34,700 –> 00:52:38,827
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the idea play is but that’s i
think where we are going to start to
1249
00:52:39,027 –> 00:52:44,180
[paul_kalbfleisch]: fix the broken society because i can’t
think of anywhere else
1250
00:52:44,460 –> 00:52:45,140
[paul_tyler]: oh m
1251
00:52:45,182 –> 00:52:47,806
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you tell me where we’re going to
fix it if it does if that’s not
1252
00:52:47,846 –> 00:52:51,452
[paul_kalbfleisch]: the front line tell me what the
front line is so that’s that’s my other
1253
00:52:51,532 –> 00:52:55,178
[paul_kalbfleisch]: big why is because i think what
we’re doing and what we’re talking here today
1254
00:52:56,080 –> 00:52:59,987
[paul_kalbfleisch]: is the front lines fixing a divided
and broken society
1255
00:53:00,740 –> 00:53:01,781
[paul_tyler]: why this was
1256
00:53:02,203 –> 00:53:02,485
[jackie_mandyck]: oh
1257
00:53:02,783 –> 00:53:09,835
[paul_tyler]: terrific conversation paul okay joy experiments will
put up link in the notes for anybody
1258
00:53:10,095 –> 00:53:10,195
[paul_tyler]: who
1259
00:53:10,186 –> 00:53:10,569
[paul_kalbfleisch]: thank you
1260
00:53:10,556 –> 00:53:12,299
[paul_tyler]: wants to get a copy this
1261
00:53:12,838 –> 00:53:13,498
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1262
00:53:12,881 –> 00:53:17,580
[paul_tyler]: how else should people reach out to
you again in touch yeah
1263
00:53:17,159 –> 00:53:23,530
[paul_kalbfleisch]: um well so you can get the
book at the joy experiments dot com um
1264
00:53:23,951 –> 00:53:29,764
[paul_kalbfleisch]: and if you want to talk to
me you can email at paul at paul
1265
00:53:29,905 –> 00:53:32,515
[paul_kalbfleisch]: consulting ink dot com
1266
00:53:32,580 –> 00:53:34,690
[paul_tyler]: terrific jackie we want
1267
00:53:34,597 –> 00:53:34,618
[paul_kalbfleisch]: m
1268
00:53:34,636 –> 00:53:35,173
[jackie_mandyck]: kay
1269
00:53:34,710 –> 00:53:37,798
[paul_tyler]: to learn more about hartford four hundred
1270
00:53:39,503 –> 00:53:39,763
[jackie_mandyck]: they can
1271
00:53:39,752 –> 00:53:39,913
[paul_tyler]: your
1272
00:53:39,824 –> 00:53:40,324
[jackie_mandyck]: go to hartford
1273
00:53:40,295 –> 00:53:40,395
[paul_tyler]: ice
1274
00:53:40,384 –> 00:53:40,525
[jackie_mandyck]: four
1275
00:53:40,435 –> 00:53:40,616
[paul_tyler]: will
1276
00:53:40,585 –> 00:53:44,371
[jackie_mandyck]: hundred hartford four hundred dot or or
they can go to the i quote plan
1277
00:53:44,471 –> 00:53:47,556
[jackie_mandyck]: and my emails right on there they’re
welcome to give me a call
1278
00:53:47,629 –> 00:53:47,812
[paul_kalbfleisch]: okay
1279
00:53:47,677 –> 00:53:48,418
[jackie_mandyck]: or shout out
1280
00:53:49,500 –> 00:53:49,922
[paul_tyler]: oh
1281
00:53:49,600 –> 00:53:49,860
[jackie_mandyck]: love
1282
00:53:49,678 –> 00:53:49,901
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1283
00:53:49,980 –> 00:53:53,508
[jackie_mandyck]: to talk to people because that’s what
gets me going and creative so
1284
00:53:53,638 –> 00:53:53,940
[paul_kalbfleisch]: oh
1285
00:53:54,350 –> 00:53:58,761
[jackie_mandyck]: um happy to have some conversations with
people if they’re interested
1286
00:53:59,980 –> 00:54:00,881
[paul_tyler]: terrific all right listen
1287
00:54:00,718 –> 00:54:01,378
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1288
00:54:01,302 –> 00:54:03,326
[paul_tyler]: paul thanks for the time jackie laura
and
1289
00:54:03,388 –> 00:54:04,588
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1290
00:54:03,646 –> 00:54:05,389
[paul_tyler]: thanks to all the listeners give us
feedback
1291
00:54:06,448 –> 00:54:07,258
[paul_kalbfleisch]: yeah
1292
00:54:07,332 –> 00:54:12,663
[paul_tyler]: suggest guests if you like to be
on here let us know and that said
1293
00:54:13,123 –> 00:54:13,143
[jackie_mandyck]: m
1294
00:54:13,445 –> 00:54:18,353
[paul_tyler]: tune again next week for another episode
of the imagined podcast thanks
1295
00:54:18,930 –> 00:54:19,091
[paul_kalbfleisch]: thank
1296
00:54:19,018 –> 00:54:19,261
[laura_dinan_haber]: thanks
1297
00:54:19,131 –> 00:54:21,736
[paul_kalbfleisch]: you for this this was a wonderful
conversation thank you
NASSAU RE/IMAGINE
